Are Breton's really as good as the hype?

[GoatLiver]

So I got to thinking the other day about which race in Skyrim was the "best" race if you can have such a thing. By best race I mean most powerful not your favourite just to clarify.

Anyway I noticed the general consensus from looking through info on the net and videos on YouTube for Skyrim build guides that most people claim the best race is Breton. While they do have a pretty good permanent bonus of 25% resist magic they have a pretty unimpressive greater power. If you are not fighting a magic using enemy then the power does nothing at all and if you are, requires you to to be hit in order to absorb with the chance to still take full damage.

The other race that gets put up with Breton as being one of the best are the Orc's. They have a height advantage over Breton's and immediate access to Orc Strongholds which on its own is not that great but their greater power is so strong they don't get any other bonuses.

One of the races that I would put forward as a contender for best race would be the Argonian's. 50% resist disease would have been useful if there where still meaningful diseases like Astral Vapors, Same with water breathing if there was any underwater content at all. However Histskin is among the best Greater Powers if not outright the best.

There are only two other races that I think could be considered as the strongest, those are Nords and High Elves. Firstly Nords, 50% resist Frost is good some would say not as good as Bretons 25% resist magic but stronger against the one element, also probably the most common form of enemy magic encountered. This coupled with the fact that Frost damages stamina as well makes it a better resistance than the Dark Elves fire resist. Their Greater Power is also pretty good as fleeing enemies won't attack you as you attack them, where as the Imperials power to calm will cause people to attack you if you attack them while they are under the effects of the power (correct me if I'm wrong I assume its the same as the Illusion spells). Nords like the Orcs are also pretty tall.

Last race is the High Elves, they get a permanent 50 bonus to magicka and their greater power to regenerate magicka is pretty decent. Very good for mage players to get out of tough spots. The effects of both bonuses can be potentially rendered obsolete with the use of mana cost reduction enchantments how ever if you don't use them or want to use different enchantments then they can be pretty powerful bonuses to have. Tallest race so best movement speed.

What makes the best race may very well come down to weather you think once a day greater powers are better than permanent effect bonuses. After some consideration I believe the greater powers are more useful as the bonus given is so much stronger and for your average everyday battles you won't be relying on either to avoid death but in the heat of the hardest boss fights the greater powers can take you from loosing horribly to wining decisively in the space of 60 seconds or less.

Based on this I currently think the strongest race are the Argonian's.

I would rate races in order of power in Skyrim:

1) Argonian
2) Orc
3) Nord
4) Breton
5) High Elf

Most of the other racial bonuses are considerably weaker IMO.

What do you all think, am I completely wrong here or are the Breton's Overrated? Have your say.

[Justice knight]

Personally I'd say Imperials are the best race- not because of bonuses or anything like that, but where their skill points are allocated at the start.
As they have skills in all the trees (magic, combat, stealth) it makes them easy to stat with and well rounded- allowing them to become a 'jack of all trades' rather than actually having a focus.

[Frost Mage]

Greater Powers have never really been what I look for when deciding what race to play as in a TES game, especially not Skyrim, where it really doesn't matter. Greater Powers are nice to have at the beginning of the game, but half the time I don't use them.

[Mattbott]

i never choose a race for its powers, so have never rated them so dont think bretons are over or underrated. They might be popular because they remind me of the aragorn type race, and are humans with elvish leanings, but that's their image and not necessarily down to their powers.

in previous games racial powers have always been unbalanced on purpose (imo) - since we're not playing a mp game there is no reason to make races all the same - if you want to build more challenge into your character by choosing a particular race with a double edged power, you can still balance that with the difficulty gauge and choosing your quests, so racial powers are never game breakers

TES is free to push races in different directions, sometimes pushing harder with some powers. I think there is as much benefit (fun and RP wise) playing a race with no extra gizmos, than one with bells and whistles (i especially like the khaajit and argonians cos their powers have generally been 'natural' ones i can forget about and these powers are probably the only racial ones i still use at higher levels).

it will be interesting to see how the MMO treats races, and i hope it doesnt make them all bland variations

[Frost Mage]

i never choose a race for its powers, so have never rated them so dont think bretons are over or underrated. They might be popular because they remind me of the aragorn type race, and are humans with elvish leanings, but that's their image and not necessarily down to their powers.

in previous games racial powers have always been unbalanced on purpose (imo) - since we're not playing a mp game there is no reason to make races all the same - if you want to build more challenge into your character by choosing a particular race with a double edged power, you can still balance that with the difficulty gauge and choosing your quests, so racial powers are never game breakers

TES is free to push races in different directions, sometimes pushing harder with some powers. I think there is as much benefit (fun and RP wise) playing a race with no extra gizmos, than one with bells and whistles (i especially like the khaajit and argonians cos their powers have generally been 'natural' ones i can forget about and these powers are probably the only racial ones i still use at higher levels).

it will be interesting to see how the MMO treats races, and i hope it doesnt make them all bland variations

[Mattbott]

lol

[Frost Mage]

It was a great post, just sayin'.

[Br3admax]

Picking a race for a certain class inforces racial stereotypes. That's not good even in a video game.

To the question, no they are not that powerful. They have Dragon Skin, but otherwise they only know conjuration. In-game, Dunmer have the most power, with Imperial nightblades a close second.

[Believe]

I don't think that Greater Powers really have any effect on how "powerful" a character is. They can only be used once per day, so unless you immediately rest after every fight, they are useless almost all the time.

[CBR JGWRR]

I don't think that Greater Powers really have any effect on how "powerful" a character is. They can only be used once per day, so unless you immediately rest after every fight, they are useless almost all the time.

Indeed.

I don't think I've ever used any of the greater powers really.

All the races are equally good, their effectiveness however depends on playstyle more than any in born ability.

[Mr.Argonian]

Some of the greater powers can turn the tide of a battle, but I always forget to use them most of the time. I mostly prefer passive bonused like the Nord's resist frost.

But on the subject of best racial powers I think redguards also have a great power. Ardenaline Rush can effectively supply them with enough stamina to do continous power attacks, staggering nearly all enemies and ensuring victory.

[Br3admax]

If we're talking greater powers, orcs win. But I thought we were talking overall.

[CBR JGWRR]

Exactly, overall there are no best races, but for a specific playstyle there are.

[SuperNull]

Anyway I noticed the general consensus from looking through info on the net and videos on YouTube for Skyrim build guides that most people claim the best race is Breton. While they do have a pretty good permanent bonus of 25% resist magic they have a pretty unimpressive greater power. If you are not fighting a magic using enemy then the power does nothing at all and if you are, requires you to to be hit in order to absorb with the chance to still take full damage.

If you combine the Breton Greater power with the The Atronach Stone you get 100% spell absorption for 1 minute every day.
This not only makes you immune to magic, but also to disease, poison, environmental damage (swim in lava) and ALL DRAGONSHOUTS.

[Mattbott]

It was a great post, just sayin'.

thanx

[Br3admax]

Okay, all of those things you just listed are magic. Disease, is magic. Fire, is magic. SHOUTS ARE IN THE MAGIC MENU.(not me yelling, just copying your caps) In fact, all of those were in the magic window. Of course they are magic. It's just a little redundant, is what I am saying.

[GoatLiver]

Interesting responses so far. Seems most of you don't value the greater powers which leaves only passive bonuses as a differential between races, other than that its really just looks that separate the races. I see the greater powers as the main separation between races remembering this thread is just about in-game characters and not lore or anything else. I don't see the value in the starting skill bonuses since they can be caught up and don't increase the skill past 100.

Some of the greater powers can turn the tide of a battle, but I always forget to use them most of the time. I mostly prefer passive bonused like the Nord's resist frost.

But on the subject of best racial powers I think redguards also have a great power. Ardenaline Rush can effectively supply them with enough stamina to do continous power attacks, staggering nearly all enemies and ensuring victory.

This is actually a pretty effective power too, I do think some of the others are a bit stronger though.

If we're talking greater powers, orcs win. But I thought we were talking overall.

Orc's greater power is definitely one of the best but do you really think it is better than practical invulnerability for 60 seconds?

If you combine the Breton Greater power with the The Atronach Stone you get 100% spell absorption for 1 minute every day.
This not only makes you immune to magic, but also to disease, poison, environmental damage (swim in lava) and ALL DRAGONSHOUTS.

This is interesting but its using more than just their power alone. Again I still think the Argonian's power is better because it heals you it effectively stops all forms of damage not just magic.

[mamba12]

Redguards resisting poison is quite helpful for a lot of dungeon crawling. Stupid falmer/chaurus can't touch me. And Adrenaline Rush is helpful when you want to POWER ATTACK ALL THE TIME!

[Mattbott]

are we defining the effectiveness of powers mainly in a damage dealing/harm avoiding context tho? its a tough argument cos youre not comparing like with like and really combat is only one part of the game as a whole

if you want to walk into a hall full of fire mages and flame atronarchs and want to emphasise your resistance to fire in general , the dunmer flame cloak power is easily the best racial power

and my thief uses his khaajiti night vision all the time, most of his waking hours (probably 75%) are night visioned, and thats way better than any single hit kill or avoid damage power he might have as a different race

@goatliver, yeah, racial appearance is possibly as important as the power to me, but tbh its the racial background i go for - dunmer are popular cos we all visited them in morrowind and their story is very rich cos of that game's material.. role playing is more important that damage per second in TES i spose

[soda popinski]

Picking a race for a certain class inforces racial stereotypes. That's not good even in a video game.

Are you serious?

In my opinion, orcs are the "best" race in terms of their powers. The beserker rage will allow you to kick the crap out of anything.

All of the other races are pretty much the same. Some of them have a power that I never remember to use, like the wood elf.

And starting skill bonuses are pretty irrelevent, as you can go from 15 to 25 in most of the skills after completing a dungeon or two.

I think skyrim improved on a lot, but I think it took a step back when it comes to the races, as there is very little difference between them (which might be good for people like Br3admax who are terrified of having a "racist" thought

[Avron the S'wit]

Personally I'd say Imperials are the best race- not because of bonuses or anything like that, but where their skill points are allocated at the start.
As they have skills in all the trees (magic, combat, stealth) it makes them easy to stat with and well rounded- allowing them to become a 'jack of all trades' rather than actually having a focus.

I definitely agree with that. Imperials are so nicely balanced in the beginning that you can make them into whatever sort of character you want, be it catering to one of the three branches (magic, combat, stealth) or a mix. I find that really impressive myself.

[snapple]

I think the Breton's passive ability is the best. I've always played as them, but this time I've been testing out other races.

[Black_Dog]

The Breton's strength could be sumed up in one word : cheap.
It's desperately easy to make a strong character with a Breton.

All you need to do is : quickly reach 85% magic resistance, reach the armor cap (80% damage reduce / 567 armor class) and you're pretty much invincible.

You don't need enchant to reach 85% magic resistance :
race bonus : 25%
lord stone : 25%
alteration perk : 20% (10% * 2)

Spoiler:

agent of Mara : 15%
This ability you get when you complete the book of love.

As for armor... well, a combination of smithing and armor skill will do.

[Kerr]

Bretons are my favourite race in TES. Both for lore and for the fact that they make great spellswords.

[Haravikk]

They're all pretty circumstantial, but one thing that annoys me is the trade-off between constant bonuses and greater powers, as the once-a-day limit on greater powers makes them an automatic non-entity for me and I won't use them. One of the things Skyrim improved, but could still improve at, was reducing time spent in the menus to select abilities, but greater-powers kind of ruin that when you could be using shouts or something else that you can rely on all the time. Skyrim also has the problem of the slant being towards enemies using frost quite a lot, particularly outdoors, which doesn't really do Dunmer any favours, and elevates Nords quite a bit, whereas I'd hoped for more equal footing.
With Skyrim I was hoping for a race perk-tree so you could have chosen greater powers or even made them unlimited uses or much more powerful as the game went on; oh well!

For these reasons I kind of agree with Bretons as being one of the best, as 25% resist magic is a good permanent ability to have, especially once you stack it with some other things like The Lord Stone, even more-so if you get the Aetherial Crown as it means that The Apprentice Stone no longer has such a bad penalty, or slap The Atronach Stone on so you've got 50% resist and 50% absorb!