Don't worry it's not a question about who to side with, I just need more help with the details of this quest...
I have done this quest a few times now and I generally used to side with Saadia because I thought this was the 'good' option. This time I have done research and really looked on how the characters behave especially with
Spoiler:
how Kematu just captures Saadia instead of just killing her
and I now lean more towards the Alik'r being more truthful.
But their stories don't add up all when I researched Hammerfell's history from around the Great War, on Kematu's side of the story, why is there resistance against the Thalmor when there's a stalemate and the Thalmor have withdrawn? Why would Saadia need to run after speaking out against the Thalmor even though there would be no need to?
Am I missing something really obvious? Any help will be great.
A hero can be anyone, even a man doing some as simple and reassuring as putting a coat around a young boy's shoulders to let him know the world hadn't ended.
Nocturnal wrote:Don't worry it's not a question about who to side with, I just need more help with the details of this quest...
I have done this quest a few times now and I generally used to side with Saadia because I thought this was the 'good' option. This time I have done research and really looked on how the characters behave especially with
Spoiler:
how Kematu just captures Saadia instead of just killing her
and I now lean more towards the Alik'r being more truthful.
But their stories don't add up all when I researched Hammerfell's history from around the Great War, on Kematu's side of the story, why is there resistance against the Thalmor when there's a stalemate and the Thalmor have withdrawn? Why would Saadia need to run after speaking out against the Thalmor even though there would be no need to?
Am I missing something really obvious? Any help will be great.
I think what Kematu's referring to would be the need to keep up a constant level of resistance because if they drop their guard, the Thalmor will seize the moment. I mean think of how they're actively attempting to prolong the war in Skyrim. They're using the Stormcloaks to weaken to Empire even more than it is currently so they can attack again.
The moment Hammerfel drops it resistance, even just moving troops from the borders, the Thalmor will strike.
Nocturnal wrote:Don't worry it's not a question about who to side with, I just need more help with the details of this quest...
I have done this quest a few times now and I generally used to side with Saadia because I thought this was the 'good' option. This time I have done research and really looked on how the characters behave especially with
Spoiler:
how Kematu just captures Saadia instead of just killing her
and I now lean more towards the Alik'r being more truthful.
But their stories don't add up all when I researched Hammerfell's history from around the Great War, on Kematu's side of the story, why is there resistance against the Thalmor when there's a stalemate and the Thalmor have withdrawn? Why would Saadia need to run after speaking out against the Thalmor even though there would be no need to?
Am I missing something really obvious? Any help will be great.
I think what Kematu's referring to would be the need to keep up a constant level of resistance because if they drop their guard, the Thalmor will seize the moment. I mean think of how they're actively attempting to prolong the war in Skyrim. They're using the Stormcloaks to weaken to Empire even more than it is currently so they can attack again.
The moment Hammerfel drops it resistance, even just moving troops from the borders, the Thalmor will strike.
I was beginning to assume that since nothing else really made sense. Still trying to figure Kematu's story with how Saadia sold out the city which will probably tie in with this theory anyways. Thanks for answering. It was just bugging me a lot.
A hero can be anyone, even a man doing some as simple and reassuring as putting a coat around a young boy's shoulders to let him know the world hadn't ended.
I could never side with the Alik'r chasing Saadia. They just come across as no good ruffians if you ask me...
"Barbarism is the natural state of mankind. Civilization is unnatural. It is a whim of circumstance. And barbarism must always ultimately triumph." - Conan the Barbarian
"A man chooses. A slave obeys." - Andrew Ryan
I see your point but then each side has their positive and negative points. I hate this quest because there's not clear cut answer.
A hero can be anyone, even a man doing some as simple and reassuring as putting a coat around a young boy's shoulders to let him know the world hadn't ended.
I think this is one of the reasons why I originally enjoyed it. Because there really isn't an answer (at least not that I have seen), it is asking you and/or your characters to rely on your morals. It is interesting to see what people's choices are, and the reasoning behind it with such an open-ended decision.
"Barbarism is the natural state of mankind. Civilization is unnatural. It is a whim of circumstance. And barbarism must always ultimately triumph." - Conan the Barbarian
"A man chooses. A slave obeys." - Andrew Ryan
I think if we could gather more information behind Hammerfell and the Thalmor like diaries/notes during this quest it would help because it is quite bare the information you do get in the first place.
A hero can be anyone, even a man doing some as simple and reassuring as putting a coat around a young boy's shoulders to let him know the world hadn't ended.
I'm more inclined to believe Kematu, because he doesn't pull a blade on you unless you make it clear that you're hellbent on killing him. Saadia on the other hand tries to lure you into an isolated room then pulls a knife.
Second, she claims to be hunted because she spoke out against the Dominion.
So what? Hammerfell and the Dominion are not on good terms. Speaking out against the Dominion would hardly be a rare thing... if she had a combative attitude toward the Dominion, why on earth would her *countrymen* be sent against her? I'm imagining it's more probable for the Dominion to have turned one Redguard as opposed to five, particularly five warriors (on the assumption that they may have just served in the war). And if you believe her and the Thalmor wanted her dead, why wouldn't the *Thalmor* come for her? I mean, with the giant, very public statue of Talos in Whiterun it's not as if they're hurting for an excuse to show up...
Finally, if you kill Kematu after he paralyzes her, she'll attack you.
Is she upset that you sold her out? She got what she wanted. I can only assume that she sees this as an opportunity to get rid of you by saying you and Kematu killed each other. And *poof* goes anyone with any leads on her identity.
I liked how at the end Kematu warns you about falling for a pretty face. I know Saadia played the part of the weak defenseless girl, but how much oif it was an act? When in doubt go with the smaller body count imo.
Nocturnal wrote:Don't worry it's not a question about who to side with, I just need more help with the details of this quest...
I have done this quest a few times now and I generally used to side with Saadia because I thought this was the 'good' option. This time I have done research and really looked on how the characters behave especially with
Spoiler:
how Kematu just captures Saadia instead of just killing her
and I now lean more towards the Alik'r being more truthful.
But their stories don't add up all when I researched Hammerfell's history from around the Great War, on Kematu's side of the story, why is there resistance against the Thalmor when there's a stalemate and the Thalmor have withdrawn? Why would Saadia need to run after speaking out against the Thalmor even though there would be no need to?
Am I missing something really obvious? Any help will be great.
Saadia didn't actually "speak out" against the Thalmor, that's her untrue version of events that she gives you in order to use you as a pawn. Although I don't remember the exact dialogue, Kematu tells you that she committed treason against Hammerfell by aiding the Thalmor. The Alik'r warriors have been sent to capture her and return her to Hammerfell where she will be put on trial for treason.
ReeceH wrote:I could never side with the Alik'r chasing Saadia. They just come across as no good ruffians if you ask me...
"Don't get fooled by a pretty face. You're better than that."
Notice hos Saadia is the one who threatens to gut you, not the man chasing her.
Monsters are bred in labyrinths, labyrinths are bred from walls. There is a reason the Giants choose to remain nomadic rather than follow their shield kin the Nords in building permanent settlements. The Tower is the beginning of all walls.
Also notice that Saadia's story doesn't really match up, as already mentioned. There's no reason for the Alik'r to be pursuing her if she "spoke out against the Thalmor". The Alik'r hate the Thalmor, as does virtually every loyal Redguard.
The only thing that really throws me... the Alik'r are in a cave with bandits. I mean really, why bandits? If they were legit then the cave would have been a functional Forward Operating Base. Instead, it was a bundle of bandits and a bunch of warriors at the back of the cave. Since we dont have ANY information about the group existing through lore. In fact the only notable groups in the desert are the Fighters Guild and The Anthotis clan of vampires.
Dark Spark wrote:They are not instruments of justice nor vengeance. They're target practice.
That which defines you will prove to be your undoing
They might be getting kicked out of every town with a decent inn, much how they're treated in whiterun. Note that they actually pay the bandits that normally reside in the cave. (learned if you sneak up close to the bandits).
It's a big "he said, she said" argument where neither side has good evidence to back up their story.
Yaije wrote:It's a big "he said, she said" argument where neither side has good evidence to back up their story.
Yes, it is a "he said/she said" thing, but Kematu only paralyzes Saadia, which lends credence to his story that the Alik'r want her alive so they can take her back to Hammerfell to stand trial. Remember, it's Saadia who tells you that they mean to kill her. Kematu's actions support his version of the story, while everything Saadia tells you seems questionable.
as far as we can tell... Kematu carries off a paralyzed woman back to his men in the wilderness. Once they leave whiterun we have no idea whether they actually make it back to trial.
Yaije wrote:as far as we can tell... Kematu carries off a paralyzed woman back to his men in the wilderness. Once they leave whiterun we have no idea whether they actually make it back to trial.
Yes, because at this point the Quest is over and there's nothing more to develop. It would have been interesting if Kematu had sent you a note sometime later, informing you of the trial's outcome. As things play out in this quest though, I'm satisfied in believing that Kematu is on the good side of the fence. Trying to read anything further into what we know quickly becomes just another conspiracy theory.
I have never sided with Saadia in this quest. First of all, she lures the pc into a room and pulls out a weapon. Ready to gut you out of nowhere. Second, wouldn't the Thalmor send one of their o.wn to kill her instead of other Alik'r? It makes more sense to me that they would. I thought she was a big fat liar
Dohvakiin2012 wrote:I have never sided with Saadia in this quest. First of all, she lures the pc into a room and pulls out a weapon. Ready to gut you out of nowhere. Second, wouldn't the Thalmor send one of their o.wn to kill her instead of other Alik'r? It makes more sense to me that they would. I thought she was a big fat liar
That's the one thing that always stuck out with me I don't see Alik'r working with the Thalmor. It's only when I thought about it that I realised that I shouldn't really be siding with her as I always did. I think this quest needed more context and information for it to work successfully.
A hero can be anyone, even a man doing some as simple and reassuring as putting a coat around a young boy's shoulders to let him know the world hadn't ended.
I always side with Saadia, but by luring her to the stables then killing the Alik'r for a good level of profit. My main reason being because I like the bannered mare with a lively number of NPC's
If Kematu is telling the truth, why does Saadia's urn show up in the Whiterun Hall of the Dead not long after they supposedly take her back to Hammerfell?
