Prohibition 2012-- and other rantings.

[Wolf]

In Oklahoma, it is illegal for a convenience or otherwise not-liquor store to sell alcohol. There is an initiative in place to strike down this law so that vendors who sell alcohol in their stores can come to Oklahoma, as well as current vendors being able to sell alcohol. That's the pro-side of the argument. The con-side of the argument is that increased alcohol sales will lead to an increase inviolence, etc. etc.

So there's the setup. Now for the response.

What the ever-loving christ is wrong with these people? They are seriously using prohibition-era arguments in a context that really doesn't make sense-- as alcohol is currently sold in Oklahoma-- nearly 100 years after it was proven beyond a shadow of anything remotely resembling a doubt that prohibition FAILED MISERABLY. This is not the first absolutely demented policy-making arguments that these people have come up with-- Oklahoma has a very long history of retarded [&@%!] like this (controversy over a billboard advertising atheism)-- and it will not be the last, but it's the one that has finally made me decide that this state just isn't worth it anymore. Don't get me wrong, I love Oklahoma. I love the lands and the big skies that I see on a daily basis, and I love the city of Oklahoma City and its quiet, out-of-the-limelight atmosphere. But I hate the people here. I despise them. They are some of the most illogical, ill-educated, authoritarian, morally self-righteous [@#@] to have ever walked the Earth. And I'm very much to the point where I won't even speak to anyone that tries to present an illogical argument-- which is more-often-than-not some Bible-hashed, contrived dogma [&@%!] so that they don't have to feel uncomfortable about reality.

I think I'm done ranting for now.... Say what you will in response.

[Dark Spark]

You need a day at the beach. Everyone needs at least one day at the beach.

[Deandra]

I'm confused. You are sick of living in Oklahoma because there is now an effort to change the law to make liquor more available?

[Dark Spark]

I'm confused. You are sick of living in Oklahoma because there is now an effort to change the law to make liquor more available?

The liquor situation is symptomatic of the obdurate and irrational administration of life found in a land where you are hundreds of miles from the nearest ocean beach.

[Br3admax]

Illogical, why are you posting here then?

[Dark Spark]

Because I have a nice avatar.

[DorostheConqueror]

Well, you seem might angry and violent already. Any more booze, and it might just set you over the edge!

Besides, alcohol will be banned everywhere, once the progressives get done with cigarettes and fast food. Don't you want Oklahoma to be hip and modern and ahead of the curve?

[Witchery]

You shouldn't hate people, dear. And insulting them with the "conservative = dumb" argument is not going to change a thing. (On and unrelated note I do believe those with higher education tend to vote to the right.)

You don't like what's going on? Do something about it. Ranting may feel good, but it's not at all productive.

[Frost Mage]

You shouldn't hate people, dear. And insulting them with the "conservative = dumb" argument is not going to change a thing. (On and unrelated note I do believe those with higher education tend to vote to the right.)

You don't like what's going on? Do something about it. Ranting may feel good, but it's not at all productive.

*wipes tears from eyes* Bwahaha, more educated people vote to the right? What the hell kind of logic is that? Politics is absolute [&@%!] already, and it doesn't help for people to think that the smarter group of society is the only group that votes for their party. No one's right in politics, there are only evils, and lesser evils, none of which either side is consistent on. And it is productive, it's a great way to get other's opinions on the matter, and overall, just venting is good for anyone.

[Dark Spark]

There is the adage that "...a young conservative is a person without a heart. An old liberal is a person without a brain."

[Witchery]

You shouldn't hate people, dear. And insulting them with the "conservative = dumb" argument is not going to change a thing. (On and unrelated note I do believe those with higher education tend to vote to the right.)

You don't like what's going on? Do something about it. Ranting may feel good, but it's not at all productive.

*wipes tears from eyes* Bwahaha, more educated people vote to the right? What the hell kind of logic is that? Politics is absolute [&@%!] already, and it doesn't help for people to think that the smarter group of society is the only group that votes for their party. No one's right in politics, there are only evils, and lesser evils, none of which either side is consistent on. And it is productive, it's a great way to get other's opinions on the matter, and overall, just venting is good for anyone.

I said more educated, not smarter. Let's look at the 2008 Presidential Election:

Spoiler:

Thank your for your sage wisdom though.

[Frost Mage]

Actually, you may have something there. The more educated, those who usually make more money, are the ones voting for conservatives, the people that keep their money safe, being more privileged than the rest of the population in most respects. The poorer, more middle-class of the population votes for liberals, who are trying to keep the table even and make it so that not all the money goes to the people that already have it.

[Gideon Dragontongue]

That chart doesn't really serve to back up anything. The data isn't in really any sort of trend, considering as the postgraduates are actually mostly Democrats.

Besides, there's no real "trend"; Republicans are rich politicians who like being rich, and like their rich friends being rich; Democrats are rich politicians who feel that other people's wealth should be distributed among the masses. It might seem to be an over-generalization at first, but unless you're actively involved in politics, most of us are actually either leftist or rightist libertarians at heart.

[Witchery]

That chart doesn't really serve to back up anything. The data isn't in really any sort of trend, considering as the postgraduates are actually mostly Democrats.

Besides, there's no real "trend"; Republicans are rich politicians who like being rich, and like their rich friends being rich; Democrats are rich politicians who feel that other people's wealth should be distributed among the masses. It might seem to be an over-generalization at first, but unless you're actively involved in politics, most of us are actually either leftist or rightist libertarians at heart.

Uhhhhh. No? Politicians are one thing... most of them are vile and corrupt no matter which side they're on.

[Frost Mage]

That chart doesn't really serve to back up anything. The data isn't in really any sort of trend, considering as the postgraduates are actually mostly Democrats.

Besides, there's no real "trend"; Republicans are rich politicians who like being rich, and like their rich friends being rich; Democrats are rich politicians who feel that other people's wealth should be distributed among the masses. It might seem to be an over-generalization at first, but unless you're actively involved in politics, most of us are actually either leftist or rightist libertarians at heart.

Uhhhhh. No? Politicians are one thing... most of them are vile and corrupt no matter which side they're on.

You know me, ne'er trust anyone, but that's just false. What grounds do you have this on?

[Gideon Dragontongue]

That chart doesn't really serve to back up anything. The data isn't in really any sort of trend, considering as the postgraduates are actually mostly Democrats.

Besides, there's no real "trend"; Republicans are rich politicians who like being rich, and like their rich friends being rich; Democrats are rich politicians who feel that other people's wealth should be distributed among the masses. It might seem to be an over-generalization at first, but unless you're actively involved in politics, most of us are actually either leftist or rightist libertarians at heart.

Uhhhhh. No? Politicians are one thing... most of them are vile and corrupt no matter which side they're on.

Not going to disagree with you there.

Let me ask you this: Do you believe that the government should regulate every aspect of people's lives, from their religion, to their sexuality, to the substances they ingest? Or should people be allowed to choose who they worship, and who they love, and what they put into their bodies?

[Frost Mage]

Real government protects its people. Fake governments regulate its population to the point of mercy.

[Gideon Dragontongue]

Right. That, right there, is the cusp of libertarianism - governments serve no purpose other than protecting their citizens from harm.

[Witchery]

Not going to disagree with you there.

Let me ask you this: Do you believe that the government should regulate every aspect of people's lives, from their religion, to their sexuality, to the substances they ingest? Or should people be allowed to choose who they worship, and who they love, and what they put into their bodies?

I geniunely care about the well-being of others. If I can help one family be stopping daddy from spending the welfare check on drugs, I will. If I can stop someone from letting lust rule their lives? Yeah, I feel a moral responsibility to do so. I know. Who do I think I am by telling others what they can or cannot do, as if I know what's best for them. I feel as if these social "restrictions" help society as a whole.

Don't get me wrong. A person's personal life is of no business of the government's... but if people vote saying they want drugs or same sex illegal, the government must uphold their decision.

[Will Zurmacht]

To the extent that the OP wants more alcohol to be sold in more outlets: huzzah!

To the extent that the OP despises backward fuddy-duddies and rednecks, of which Oklahoma is an undoubted leading producer: huzzah!

But!

I'm very much to the point where I won't even speak to anyone that tries to present an illogical argument-- which is more-often-than-not some Bible-hashed, contrived dogma [&@%!] so that they don't have to feel uncomfortable about reality.

Don't forget that the most stubborn, irrational, traditional, and selfishly provincial kind of outlook is also the strongest outlook in the sense of prompting action. You have to learn to translate all your beautiful rhetoric and logic into the simplistic motives that drive people most strongly, if you want to change anything amongst the masses.

[House of the Wolf]

@OP: Wolf, I keep telling you to move you ass here to Maryland. Or at least here to the East Coast, anywhere from Maryland on north (with a very small exception...*cough*NJ*cough*...*cough*..[sorry, the extra cough was from all the smog from that place]).

I'm not going to pretend to understand your frustration with this specific case--unless it's the proverbial straw + camel--but I can tell you that the news I usually hear out of Oklahoma, and a few of the other Midwestern states have me scratching my head most of the time.

[Frost Mage]

Not going to disagree with you there.

Let me ask you this: Do you believe that the government should regulate every aspect of people's lives, from their religion, to their sexuality, to the substances they ingest? Or should people be allowed to choose who they worship, and who they love, and what they put into their bodies?

I geniunely care about the well-being of others. If I can help one family be stopping daddy from spending the welfare check on drugs, I will. If I can stop someone from letting lust rule their lives? Yeah, I feel a moral responsibility to do so. I know. Who do I think I am by telling others what they can or cannot do, as if I know what's best for them. I feel as if these social "restrictions" help society as a whole.

Don't get me wrong. A person's personal life is of no business of the government's... but if people vote saying they want drugs or same sex illegal, the government must uphold their decision.

Considering the poll system is easily cheated, and often corrupt. Yes, "the government would decide to make same sex marriage and drugs illegal", because it is republicans who always get their way, because most of America is too ignorant to understand what's going on, and ignorance is NOT a product of being "uneducated".

[Veck]

ALERT: POTENTIALLY AND IRONICALLY OFFENSIVE AND IGNORANT STATEMENT INCOMING

Wolf, what do I always tell you about the Bible belt? Get away from the hicks and crazies while you sill can.

[Wolf]

Witchery, this thread was a rant. People use emotional language in a rant. And for the record, you're actually terribly wrong. If I really thought it was worth my time, I'd scan the statistics from my textbook, but more educated people actually tend to be more tolerant and more moderate.

Deandra, my problem is that they're using a 90-year-old dogmatic argument that was proven unequivocally false 80 years ago.

Doros, never gonna happen. Liberal people love alcohol! They break the age law just so they can drink it, and smoke pot. Oh, hold on. You said progressive people. Actually, I think the trend is towards liberal progressivism. The health craze is certainly a modern fadtastic button-policy, but I get the feeling that they're just not gonna be able to stretch the fabric enough to get it their way. Also, [&@%!] you, Bloomberg. The citizens of New York are not your children, sir.

Veck, thank you for that response. I love you for being you, and sometimes I need to hear you say these things.

Dark Spark... Priceless.

[Wolf]

See, and I agree with that. I'm not usually this vocal about these kinds of issues-- it's just I'm so awestruck at this waste of tax dollars that I needed to rant.