Sexuality

[Deandra]

You think their views are wrong because they think your views are wrong. I like it.

I'm not sure what you're trying to get at here.

I'm being sarcastic. It's difficult to accuse others of something you're doing yourself, unless you're willing to accept you want a double standard, though that would tend to invalidate your complaint.

Actually, isn't it pretty much always the case that if somebody thinks you are wrong that you will also think they are wrong?

Also, it's not the same at all if other people keep trying to interfere in something between consenting adults that doesn't concern them at all, and all you want is to just be able to mind your own business.

[Taters]

Also, it's not the same at all if other people keep trying to interfere in something between consenting adults that doesn't concern them at all, and all you want is to just be able to mind your own business.

I'll agree with this. When someone thinks I'm wrong, it doesn't make them wrong in my book, just a jerk.

[Тeatime]

You think their views are wrong because they think your views are wrong. I like it.

I'm not sure what you're trying to get at here.

I'm being sarcastic. It's difficult to accuse others of something you're doing yourself, unless you're willing to accept you want a double standard, though that would tend to invalidate your complaint.

Soo, people disagreeing amounts to double standards? You're not making any sense to me.
I don't see the double standard in calling someone's view wrong when it contradicts the view you hold to be true, it'd be hypocritical not to. That said there's no reason to be uncivil in disagreement. If I disagree with someone I'd tell them why and probably attempt to debate things, if they're receptive and don't just stick their fingers in their ears and keep telling you you're wrong.

[Jeff]

- You do not have to live with other people if you chose not too. Are you chained to them? If they were your freind, then they would accept you as you are. If they do not, then they are not your friend. There is no law that says you have to stay in touch with your family. If they do not accept you as you are, then they obviously do not love you unconditionally, as family should, so really are not family.

- This does not explain peoples actions on the internet. People on the internet have no affect on your life what so ever. If people on the internet do not like you for who you are, then you can always find another website, foe/ignore them, even block them.

- I agree with Jedi in that most people who try to defend their lifesyles on the internet do more harm, and cause more damage to make people not like thier lifestyle even more.

- You cannot demand respect. You have to earn respect, by giving respect.

- You cannot expect people to understand your point of view, unless you are also willing to understand their point of view.

- If you want someone to let you live your life the way you chose to, then you also have to allow them to live their life the way they chose to.

[House of the Wolf]

- This does not explain peoples actions on the internet. People on the internet have no affect on your life what so ever. If people on the internet do not like you for who you are, then you can always find another website, foe/ignore them, even block them.

- I agree with Jedi in that most people who try to defend their lifesyles on the internet do more harm, and cause more damage to make people not like thier lifestyle even more.

- You cannot demand respect. You have to earn respect, by giving respect.

This would be a respectable point if you hadn't freaked-out at me earlier over something I didn't say. You took what I did say and turned it into this whole discussion about something that wasn't even there, but now you're claiming the high-road.

And no, respect should be a given until someone loses it. Unless you plan on just being an ass.

- If you want someone to let you live your life the way you chose to, then you also have to allow them to live their life the way they chose to.

Unless they're, in some way, advocating the denial of your rights/happiness, then most people have no choice.

[Тeatime]

I'm with House of the Wolf on this one, also:

- You do not have to live with other people if you chose not too. Are you chained to them? If they were your freind, then they would accept you as you are. If they do not, then they are not your friend. There is no law that says you have to stay in touch with your family. If they do not accept you as you are, then they obviously do not love you unconditionally, as family should, so really are not family.

We can choose our friends, we can't choose our classmates or workmates as freely.
Family can love you while disagreeing with you.
Oh, and we do have to live with other people whether we want to or not, unless you've got the skills to survive by your own in the wilds. We can choose what circles to move in by some extent but we can't escape society altogether.

[leroybrown]

Lighten up for crying out loud.

Legitimate Question: Why is it that people who go against the "norm", are always so defensive about it, to the point of being aggressive/militant?

If you are confident, content, happy, (whatever word you want to use), then why does it bother you so much that others do not like, or agree with it?

I text walled about this on another forum. My point was that their 'in your face' attitude is counter productive towards their goals. Feminists have been like this lately.

Except that shaving ones ass is completely irrelevant to pretty much anything, while being discriminated against because of which sex chromosomes you were born with on issues like freedom and income is so important that it shapes pretty much every aspect of your life when you're the one being discriminated against. In a world where women are the victims of war rape, honor killings, genital mutilation, forced marriages and thousands of laws and taboos to oppress them, you're wondering why feminists are furious? Really?

BTW, feminists have never gotten anywhere by asking politely, so your point is ridiculous.

I've done this debate a few times now and you are an example of what I am talking about. Obviously not all, but many feminists do not allow a grey area. It's either, "You're with us, or you're against us!" If anyone plays devils advocate they are regarded as hateful invalids. It then boils down to symantics and 'clever' insults.

Nobody likes frequent anger-fueled rhetoric in any debate. That is a sure fire way to turn people off to whatever you are arguing for. That is kind of like a city council meeting; someone comes on to the mic and starts yelling at the council how everything is going wrong. They get it, understand it, but you are not helping.

I have learned from debating with feminists that some do not understand common patterns in life or human psychology, or they do and are hypocrites. Here is why I say that

1 Of the feminists I've talked to, they do not care about my issues. They do not get heated about refugee camps. They do not get heated about world hunger, they do not get heated about anything else. Ask a feminists non chalantly about the statistics of people that die in Afghanistan from IED's and the response will be something like, "Oh that's terrible."

But ask about feminism and then comes the screaming tirade.

This leaves me to believe that some feminists do not understand the commonly preached concepte that everyone in life has their own problems. I understand that it hits home when it affects you directly. But like I said, not every feminist is this way. The (in my opinion) smart feminists learn to mentally absorb this concept. Then they can cordially debate statistics, studies, whatever. These are the types of feminists that can convert people to their cause, which leads me to my next point.

2 What loud feminists should do is focus on how they are helping or hurting their cause. Feminists goals should be to educate the community (people in genera) about the problems/issues facing women. You have to convert a certain amount of the population (cr%). I do not believe that being rude to folks on the internet is a good way to achieve a high CR%.

If you contact me and claim to be a feminist then that is fine. I will be interested and you may convince me to sign an online pettition or whatever. Something. That's more than I do now for the feminist cause. But if you tell me I am wrong and my opinions are rediculous then I wont help you. Nobody will.

[Jeff]

How do you know I freaked out? How do you know that I took you seriously? In fact, you have no idea where I am going with this, or why I am doing this.

You are correct, you should expect to be given respect. Treat others the way that you would want them to treat you.

However, I am also correct in that you can not demand respect. If someone does not respect you, or your way of life, you cannot demand that they do. You can not force them to respect you. You have to earn that respect, by giving them respect, even though they may not deserve it. Otherwise, you are no better than them. Becoming defensive, and even militant, is the worst thing to do.

You always have a choice. It is what you do with that choice that matters, how you handle it, and what you make of it.

Explain to me how someone on an internet forum saying that they do not like same sex partners, and that they do not deserve the same rights affects you?

That is their opinion, and they have a right to it. Arguing, or becoming defensive with them will not change their mind, and it will not do anything to help you get the rights that you want. Unless that person happens to be a lawmaker, and will actually have a say in it.

I could care less. I am not pro or con. Live your life the way you want to.

Direct your energies where it will do the most good. Go to Rally's, sign pettitions, become active, and make a difference. Nothing that happens on a Gaming Fan Site/Forum will affect you, or help you in your cause.

[House of the Wolf]

How do you know I freaked out? How do you know that I took you seriously? In fact, you have no idea where I am going with this, or why I am doing this.

That's rich; you inferred, quite falsely, that I was attacking your initial comment when all I was doing was joking with you. Perhaps you should remember your own words ^ next time.

You are correct, you should expect to be given respect. Treat others the way that you would want them to treat you.

However, I am also correct in that you can not demand respect. If someone does not respect you, or your way of life, you cannot demand that they do. You can not force them to respect you. You have to earn that respect, by giving them respect, even though they may not deserve it. Otherwise, you are no better than them. Becoming defensive, and even militant, is the worst thing to do.

You're conflating respect with friendliness. People don't have to like each other, but they should respect each other. Even anonymously.

Explain to me how someone on an internet forum saying that they do not like same sex partners, and that they do not deserve the same rights affects you?

That is their opinion, and they have a right to it. Arguing, or becoming defensive with them will not change their mind, and it will not do anything to help you get the rights that you want. Unless that person happens to be a lawmaker, and will actually have a say in it.

Most people share the need to communicate. While nothing happens in the grand scheme of things by debating with someone online, it can help one to gather their thoughts, organize their ideas, or perhaps simply vent their frustrations. It's also a way to see things from the other side's perspective. Hence "General Discussion".

I could care less. I am not pro or con. Live your life the way you want to.

Good. Then why even bring it up? Afterall, it's "on an internet forum" that you've brought up this discussion in the first place.

Direct your energies where it will do the most good. Go to Rally's, sign pettitions, become active, and make a difference. Nothing that happens on a Gaming Fan Site/Forum will affect you, or help you in your cause.

Again, then why are you on here? As you said above, how do you know those discussing on here haven't already participated in some way? It must be nice sitting on such a high horse.

[Taters]

That is all.

[Deandra]

If you contact me and claim to be a feminist then that is fine. I will be interested and you may convince me to sign an online pettition or whatever. Something. That's more than I do now for the feminist cause. But if you tell me I am wrong and my opinions are rediculous then I wont help you. Nobody will.

As if clicktivism does anything. Petitions don't mean jack. And it's not about abstract causes or statistics, it's about how you live your life. How you interact with the males and females you see on a daily basis.

Here's how I promote feminism online: I let people know I'm a female, and that I am a human being. I don't paste photos of myself fishing for compliments. I share the real issues I face. I don't put on an act, I try my best to be myself, so that hopefully I'll break down the perception among some folks that women are an inferior variation of humanity.

I really don't care if you dislike me--it's not like this forum is a popularity contest. But if, maybe by sharing my story, maybe by RPing a female character who is independent and capable and exists as more than eye candy, or whatever it is, I help people see that women are real human beings rather than sex objects or demons, I will have achieved whatever feminist goals I have when it comes to my online interactions.

I don't care how you label yourself, either. If you already treat people with dignity and respect regardless of their sex, congratulations, you're doing a great job to promote the feminist cause. Unfortunately, many people don't seem to be that enlightened.

If you're going to decide to treat women as a whole worse just because of something I (or anybody else) posted online, well... let's just say I hope you're not that immature.

[leroybrown]

As if clicktivism does anything. Petitions don't mean jack.

I understand why you would say this, but it isn't true. Check this out: http://www.change.org/victories

And it's not about abstract causes or statistics, it's about how you live your life. How you interact with the males and females you see on a daily basis.

Causes and statistics can help present the problems to the world. Mature readers only:

Spoiler:

This is from an old article:
"Last year, I reported with the intrepid Glenna Gordon a story about Liberia's Court E, a court chamber in the capital city of Monrovia dedicated only to rape cases. The court, which will turn two in Februrary, was a direct response to what many people we met called a rape "epidemic" in Liberia. The country's post-war rape stats are sky-high, and most of the victims are young girls."

I have an unquenchable thirst for cultures. While studying foreign culture I come across articles like this all the time that hurts my heart. THIS is why I know feminism is not a bs cause. Because of my knowledge from reading and studying.

Here's how I promote feminism online: I let people know I'm a female, and that I am a human being. I don't paste photos of myself fishing for compliments. I share the real issues I face. I don't put on an act, I try my best to be myself, so that hopefully I'll break down the perception among some folks that women are an inferior variation of humanity.

Really? Then why no love for Leroy? I posted once and you jumped on me like a starving bear.

[Deandra]

Really? Then why no love for Leroy? I posted once and you jumped on me like a starving bear.

As far as I could tell, you were saying feminists are like people who shave their ass and then get all defensive when people say that's a weird thing to do. From what you just posted, I can see that's not what you actually believe.

[Travalanche]

I'm asexual tbh... I mean I just don't really get attracted to other people unless they have a lot of money. It's just that sex is transitory and pointless in many cases unless you can profit long-term from it imo.

[Dark Lord Cam]

I'm an ostrich that likes badgers.

[Deandra]

I'm an ostrich that likes badgers.

On this forum, those are more common than females who like males.

[The Loner]

I'm an ostrich that likes badgers.

On this forum, those are more common than females who like males.

While my vote is with the badgers, I am a straight female who likes male badgers

[Gideon Dragontongue]

Cute female ferret, you mean.

[The Loner]

I swear, the ferrets' cuteness stares into my soul

[cowleyj]

The ferret's ugly. I hate ferrets...and most animals....

[MARS]

Which is related to this thread in what way?

[cowleyj]

My apologies. I shal return to being on-topic...I'm straight. Quite simple really.