Khajiit species and moons

[JoeyDestructo]

if you'll look at the lore page on khajiit, you will see that their morphology is based on the Lunar Lattice, or the phases of the moon at birth....well during the void nights, what were the results of having no moons?? I mean, what kinda khajiits were born then if there wasnt a moon to influence their growth....

just found this interesting

[Pilaf The Defiler]

It was stated in "The Great War" that the Khajiit suffered horribly during this time period. I would imagine stillborn babies or worse.

[KlibanKatz]

Maybe this would be a great point to explore in a mod or some fan fiction for those Khajiit enthusiasts....

[Chaos the N'wah]

Well within the cycles, the Suthay Khajiit are the ones born when both moons are hidden...but the stillborn idea makes sense..

[JoeyDestructo]

the whole thing seems pretty sick if you think about an entire generation of still birth......wtfffffffff

[Anonymous98223]

Is it state in the Lore what caused the void of nights

[Dark Spark]

It was stated in "The Great War" that the Khajiit suffered horribly during this time period. I would imagine stillborn babies or worse.

Worse? You mean, like all the babies came out as Wood Elves instead?

[enyamerT]

Is it state in the Lore what caused the void of nights

The cause is as yet unknown. The Thalmor took credit for ending it, so there's the theory (albeit a very unlikely one) that they somehow managed to cause it. I doubt they have that kind of power, though.

[Pilaf The Defiler]

Regardless, it's very symbolic. The moons represent the decaying flesh of Lorkhan, and Talos represents a mortal manifestation of his soul.

Also, according to Varieties of Faith in the Empire:

Lorkhan (The Missing God): This Creator-Trickster-Tester deity is in every Tamrielic mythic tradition. His most popular name is the Aldmeri 'Lorkhan', or Doom Drum. He convinced or contrived the Original Spirits to bring about the creation of the mortal plane, upsetting the status quo -- much like his father Padomay had introduced instability into the universe in the Beginning Place. After the world is materialized, Lorkhan is separated from his divine center, sometimes involuntarily, and wanders the creation of the et'Ada. He and his metaphysical placement in the 'scheme of things' is interpreted a variety of ways. In Morrowind, for example, he is a being related to the Psijiic Endeavor, a process by which mortals are charged with transcending the gods that created them. To the High Elves, he is the most unholy of all higher powers, as he forever broke their connection to the spirit plane. In the legends, he is almost always an enemy of the Aldmer and, therefore, a hero of early Mankind.


^ This is getting closer to the fundamental ideological schism between the Aldmeri Dominion and the Empire of Men. Therefore, regardless of whether it's possible for them to erase Shor's body from the night sky, it serves their purpose and helped weaken worship of him among men, even if most men don't realize when they worship Tiber Septim they're also worshiping Shezarr.

[Shanparr]

You know, I wonder if Bethesda won't take this idea and use it as a way to justify there being only one type of khajiit if they ever show Elsweyr in a game.

[JoeyDestructo]

You know, I wonder if Bethesda won't take this idea and use it as a way to justify there being only one type of khajiit if they ever show Elsweyr in a game.

i swear if they do that il be very [&@%!] off

[Shanparr]

You know, I wonder if Bethesda won't take this idea and use it as a way to justify there being only one type of khajiit if they ever show Elsweyr in a game.

i swear if they do that il be very [&@%!] off

What I'd do is say that the Thalmor declared the whole Lunar Lattice thing to be heretical and burned every document referring to it in Tamriel. Since that time only one type of khajiit has existed. They can make a slight joke out of it.

Though I think it was a mistake on Bethesda's part to add this to the lore in the first place. They should just ignored the inconsistency between Arena and Morrowind.

[JoeyDestructo]

I really like the idea though of the different khajiit species, especially the Senche-raht, which apparently is "as tall as 2 altmer, and can weight more then 50"

[Pilaf The Defiler]

Yes, apparently some breeds are more common than others outside of the lands formerly known as Elswyr. I personally wish we could see the variation that appeared more Elven again, not because I don't love cat people but because a lot of casual or newer TES fans have no idea they're cousins with the Bosmer and shared common ancestors.

[Shanparr]

I really like the idea though of the different khajiit species, especially the Senche-raht, which apparently is "as tall as 2 altmer, and can weight more then 50"

I don't because so far it has served no useful purpose for the series. We never ever SEE these khajiit. It's frustrates me and it's a little confusing. It makes Elswyr sound... interesting, but also kind of dysfunctional. I mean there are enough khajiit breeds that if you made them all playable they'd double the available races in the game just by themselves.

I just think it's... blah.

[Chaos the N'wah]

There's a lot in TES that "serves no useful purpose", it's called lore and makes the world more interesting. There are tons of races, not just sub-species, that we haven't seen like Sload, Imga, Maormer, Lilmothiit, the other Argonian sub-species, any definitive Akaviri race, etc. and quite a few we won't likely see in the next game either. It's there to give depth beyond "YO DAR BE CAT PEOPLE"

[Pilaf The Defiler]

There's a lot in TES that "serves no useful purpose", it's called lore and makes the world more interesting. There are tons of races, not just sub-species, that we haven't seen like Sload, Imga, Maormer, Lilmothiit, the other Argonian sub-species, any definitive Akaviri race, etc. and quite a few we won't likely see in the next game either. It's there to give depth beyond "YO DAR BE CAT PEOPLE"

Yeah. There's a wealth of background lore in this series. It's not forced down your throat too hard when you play the actual games, but they leave little bread crumbs like references in dialogue and the game books (which are an optional but fulfilling part of the TES experience, for me) that really fill in this fantasy universe and make it so much deeper and more interesting than it began. A lot of people play these games and never really scratch beyond the surface, and that's ok. You can enjoy them on that level, but I've really come to appreciate the thought and care that went into not only crafting a history, but presenting it from differing points of view and purposely leaving gaps and contradictions, like our real world histories and religious systems.

[KlibanKatz]

There's a lot in TES that "serves no useful purpose", it's called lore and makes the world more interesting. There are tons of races, not just sub-species, that we haven't seen like Sload, Imga, Maormer, Lilmothiit, the other Argonian sub-species, any definitive Akaviri race, etc. and quite a few we won't likely see in the next game either. It's there to give depth beyond "YO DAR BE CAT PEOPLE"

Yeah. There's a wealth of background lore in this series. It's not forced down your throat too hard when you play the actual games, but they leave little bread crumbs like references in dialogue and the game books (which are an optional but fulfilling part of the TES experience, for me) that really fill in this fantasy universe and make it so much deeper and more interesting than it began. A lot of people play these games and never really scratch beyond the surface, and that's ok. You can enjoy them on that level, but I've really come to appreciate the thought and care that went into not only crafting a history, but presenting it from differing points of view and purposely leaving gaps and contradictions, like our real world histories and religious systems.

There's also a lot of "useless" information that exists in our own history archives and catalogues of behavior and species. It's only useless because it's not yet relevant to you, personally. It would make more sense to catalogue these things before they become relevant, or so they can be made relevant rather than to be ignored until we are inextricably compelled to acknowledge it. I feel it is the same case in the TES series. You could also say in this context that the Dunmer were irrelevant before Morrowind, the Imperials before Oblivion, and the Nords before Skyrim. Instead the devs breathe life into the information we've already gathered, and add as necessary. This wealth gives room to expand upon for both the devs and modders, and allows players to explore as little or as much as they'd like. If you're fascinated by the Khajiiti people, wouldn't you want to know everything you can about their race and culture and not have to wait for TESX: Elseweyr/Anequina/Pelletine? These resources are wonderful for those in the Tamriel Rebuilt project and similar projects. The TES lore, in its complete incompleteness, adds a richness to the world and is almost satirical in that it emulates the imperfection of real world matters. Or, we can look at it as a wonderful exercise of skill and craft. If they didn't go to these great lengths to create the Khajiit and rather simply allowed them to exist, I'd consider them glorified furries, or a corruption (I didn't realize that "The process of bringing something to a form which is not as good as the one it was in before" was considered a no-no word. o_0) of the Mithra (of the FF series), which is decidedly less complex, but a cute novelty. And I'd be disappointed in Bethesda.

[Frost Mage]

This is the reason Khajiit look so non-beast like in Arena. Their generation was born under an Ohmes moon.

[Anonymous98223]

Are the Khajiit desended from elves? I was under the impression that nobody knew and that they where already in Tamriel when the elves arived.

[Chaos the N'wah]

Are the Khajiit desended from elves? I was under the impression that nobody knew and that they where already in Tamriel when the elves arived.

There's no definitive answer, people just like to fling out what they've read *stares*
If you believe the Khajiit themselves, the bosmer came from them.

My personal opinion, they are descended from the Old Ehlnofey (the Aldmers' ancestors) who were stranded on Tamriel after the ancient unnamed Ehlnofey wars. They're about as far from being elves while still being of elven descent.

[Ralok]

I thought I would pitch in a thought before this thread faded into oblivion

I am under the impression that khajiit of specific types mostly only give birth to that type because of various problems carrying children of other types to term

And one thing we have to remember is well . . . alot of these various subspecies look similiar enough that they would probably be misconstrued as normal variation by outside species

Suthay, and Suthay-raht are basically the same, one is shorter than the other a normal human sees this as just one being coincidentally shorter

Cathay and Cathay-raht are probably in the same situation, and they look plenty like the suthay

In fact alot of these subspecies we have probably seen but not noticed, maybe undefined ones are just defined by the markings of their fur

[JoeyDestructo]

I thought I would pitch in a thought before this thread faded into oblivion

I am under the impression that khajiit of specific types mostly only give birth to that type because of various problems carrying children of other types to term

hmmmm I thought somehow they were tied to the Lunar Lattice and that has some sort of influence on their growth

[Lady Nerevar]

Got a source for that Ralok? I can't recall having read anything like that. As I know it, all Khajiit start out as more or less identical kittens, and then change as they mature.

[Chaos the N'wah]

I'd always assumed that the reason that certain subspecies are designated as being from a certain area (like the Dagi living in the Tenmar forest, but rarely anywhere else) was because Khajiit are either naturally constrained to or practice mating 'seasons' around the moons' cycles