This is it

[Tesknowitall]

I felt real stupid when i was a notorious DB killer while I was the Champion of Cyrodiil... And leader of every other faction.....

I think I'll enjoy this system.. It's kinda cool being a pawn working for a faction. instead of owning it.

[Pobatti]

Love that whole concept to death! Can't wait to see how they're handling DB assassinations (if they use regular NPCs they'd eventually all die ).

That assumes they don't just replace the NPCs at certain intervals with re-generated generics while you're away from town like many other games do. Sure, if you were fast enough you might just be able to slaughter a whole town, but that doesn't mean there's no safety net where the town would slowly repopulate while you're on some other business.

I do wonder whether the DB random scripts take into account the fact that some of the NPCs are in fact flagged as essential - because it sure would suck to get a generated quest that requires you to kill the unkillable.

I'd think they DB quests would only need you to target the 'Megaton Settler' type generics - which in this game would be harder to really tell apart from the hand crafted NPCs you'll see all around you. These can easily be replaced.

[Frost Mage]

Love that whole concept to death! Can't wait to see how they're handling DB assassinations (if they use regular NPCs they'd eventually all die ).

That assumes they don't just replace the NPCs at certain intervals with re-generated generics while you're away from town like many other games do. Sure, if you were fast enough you might just be able to slaughter a whole town, but that doesn't mean there's no safety net where the town would slowly repopulate while you're on some other business.

I do wonder whether the DB random scripts take into account the fact that some of the NPCs are in fact flagged as essential - because it sure would suck to get a generated quest that requires you to kill the unkillable.

I'd think they DB quests would only need you to target the 'Megaton Settler' type generics - which in this game would be harder to really tell apart from the hand crafted NPCs you'll see all around you. These can easily be replaced.

That would work if they all had a randomly generated backround so it felt like there was an actual motive to each kill, rather than, "He's a bad guy and needs to be killed.".

[Chaos the N'wah]

That's assuming that they are sending you to kill someone within a town/city, they could very well send you to kill someone at a bandit camp, cave, Dwemer ruin, or other places in the wilderness

[Pobatti]

That would work if they all had a randomly generated backround so it felt like there was an actual motive to each kill, rather than, "He's a bad guy and needs to be killed.".

I can't see any other way it could work. The other NPCs would surely be developed enough to the point where it simply can't be left to the RNG to come out with some really out of character reason for that person to be killed. The generics are 'generic' by nature so they're like a blank canvas and things like the DB missions could only help involve them more in the game's world.

And, as Chaos stated, you could be sent out into the wilds. In these cases, you'd just get some random bandit spawning (like they normally do) with a generated 'unique' name for you to target. That would also work well.

I can see the DB generated missions to be a mixture between these two types.

[Secondrow]

very cool concept. should keep players busy for quite a while before DLC comes out.

[Incurable Pessimist]

That would work if they all had a randomly generated backround so it felt like there was an actual motive to each kill, rather than, "He's a bad guy and needs to be killed.".

I can't see any other way it could work. The other NPCs would surely be developed enough to the point where it simply can't be left to the RNG to come out with some really out of character reason for that person to be killed. The generics are 'generic' by nature so they're like a blank canvas and things like the DB missions could only help involve them more in the game's world.

And, as Chaos stated, you could be sent out into the wilds. In these cases, you'd just get some random bandit spawning (like they normally do) with a generated 'unique' name for you to target. That would also work well.

I can see the DB generated missions to be a mixture between these two types.

He's saying the background to each kill could be randomly generated. "s/hes a noble in the court of W, X wants her dead because s/he Y'ed him and wants to Z"

[Frost Mage]

That would work if they all had a randomly generated backround so it felt like there was an actual motive to each kill, rather than, "He's a bad guy and needs to be killed.".

I can't see any other way it could work. The other NPCs would surely be developed enough to the point where it simply can't be left to the RNG to come out with some really out of character reason for that person to be killed. The generics are 'generic' by nature so they're like a blank canvas and things like the DB missions could only help involve them more in the game's world.

And, as Chaos stated, you could be sent out into the wilds. In these cases, you'd just get some random bandit spawning (like they normally do) with a generated 'unique' name for you to target. That would also work well.

I can see the DB generated missions to be a mixture between these two types.

He's saying the background to each kill could be randomly generated. "s/hes a noble in the court of W, X wants her dead because s/he Y'ed him and wants to Z"

You got it .

[Chaos the N'wah]

Even the in-town kills could be extra npcs generated (instead of sending you to kill someone you know), for example

"Your mission, if you choose to accept it, is to track down and kill ambassador <insert name> of <insert province>, he/she is there to forge an alliance with <insert hold name> and our client wishes for <insert hold name> to remain independent. Last known sighting was near the <insert province> border, but no new reports have come back...

[Pobatti]

He's saying the background to each kill could be randomly generated. "s/hes a noble in the court of W, X wants her dead because s/he Y'ed him and wants to Z"

Yes, I realised that. It could be done with practically any NPC (that's not essential), but since there are sure to be a mix of hand crafted and generic NPCs wandering the world it would make sense for these generics (who we don't know actually are generics because with a random name generator they'll no longer be called 'Megaton Settler' or anything) because:

- They're inexhaustible (they can easily be replaced by the game's engine)
- They're useless (killing them won't break any quests or remove utilities)
- They have no fleshed out background (the DB quests would assign them)

[Pobatti]

Even the in-town kills could be extra npcs generated (instead of sending you to kill someone you know), for example

"Your mission, if you choose to accept it, is to track down and kill ambassador <insert name> of <insert province>, he/she is there to forge an alliance with <insert hold name> and our client wishes for <insert hold name> to remain independent. Last known sighting was near the <insert province> border, but no new reports have come back...

That would be a 'specially spawned generic', which is another take on my 'generic victims' theory. That would also work rather well, be pretty cool and easy to implement.

So that's three styles these DB missions might take, it's starting to look really interesting

[Tesknowitall]

So this could give more freedom to the player. No more "blah blah is unconscious" that was annoying. Sometimes I just wanted to murder certain people.

[Pobatti]

So this could give more freedom to the player. No more "blah blah is unconscious" that was annoying. Sometimes I just wanted to murder certain people.

Nope, that will still happen. There are always going to be 'essential' NPCs that can't be killed.

For example children, and Main Quest NPCs.

Some games actually make it physically impossible to perform an aggressive action with an 'essential' NPC within the hit box or in the target sights (for example certain NPCs in GTA4 were impossible to kill because Niko would just put his gun away if you tried to shoot them), but Bethesda's methods usually aren't quite so refined.

In Fallout 3, a similar trick to GTA4 was employed to protect the children in Lamplight Caverns (you couldn't get your weapon out while inside that cave), but with the children of Skyrim appearing seemingly all over the place it's far more likely they've just got an 'essential' flag set in Skyrim.

[Tesknowitall]

I know what you mean, But in Oblivion there were a few people with crowns hovering over them who could easily be replaced by any other NPC. What about shop keepers? It would be cool if they got replaced over time.

[Pobatti]

I know what you mean, But in Oblivion there were a few people with crowns hovering over them who could easily be replaced by any other NPC. What about shop keepers? It would be cool if they got replaced over time.

We know they do. Kill a shopkeeper, a family member inherits the shop

These sort of mechanics will certainly reduce the number of 'inexplicable essentials' yet this is probably counter balanced by the existence of children, and I'd still expect 'guard leaders' to be essential in the same way they were in Oblivion. The 'essential' tag is still in operation but it looks to be used much more sensibly this time around.

[Frost Mage]

Just what I was thinking. They'll probably use the same engine for DB quest, fortunately.

[Grasshopper]

Just got confirmation that I can go pick up my copy for the PS3, anyone else able to pick up the PS3 version? Do I need to wait until 11.11.11 before playing?

[AKB]

PS3 and the Xbox aren't locked if you get your hands on a copy. PC players likely have to wait until midnight on the east coast of the US to play it (from what I understand, at least).

[Grasshopper]

Well then, looks like I'm knocking off work early today.

[Pobatti]

Just got confirmation that I can go pick up my copy for the PS3, anyone else able to pick up the PS3 version? Do I need to wait until 11.11.11 before playing?

Console games never have 'date locks' on them like PC games do - that's because of the copyright protection mechanisms in place on the PC platform, in this case Steam activation. You shouldn't have any problems playing on a system that's online - since you personally have not broken any rules, terms or conditions you won't get punished by Sony. In fact, it's probably advised you do connect if you can as I'm hearing stories that the version 1.1 patch is already live.

[SpikeSpeigel]

very cool concept. should keep players busy for quite a while before DLC comes out.

BEFORE the DLC comes out?? For me I wont be able to start DLC for a LONG time.
I will download it at first chance of course for the extra level caps
The DLC will give us something significant to do while running through the infinite Radiant Story assignments after completing the game. (Damn, that sounds good!)

This new news is pure awesome and locks up Game of the Year for sure.

[Wolfie]

Mods, I want to say your braver then I, for I would have jumped ship at the idea of having to mod this site in the weeks and months to followw, keep up the good work

[Pobatti]

Mods, I want to say your braver then I, for I would have jumped ship at the idea of having to mod this site in the weeks and months to followw, keep up the good work

You mean the quiet period when nobody's on

[Wolfie]

Sadily no just wait to the *shudders* PC problems

[Lynx2069]

Just got confirmation that I can go pick up my copy for the PS3, anyone else able to pick up the PS3 version? Do I need to wait until 11.11.11 before playing?

Console games never have 'date locks' on them like PC games do - that's because of the copyright protection mechanisms in place on the PC platform, in this case Steam activation. You shouldn't have any problems playing on a system that's online - since you personally have not broken any rules, terms or conditions you won't get punished by Sony. In fact, it's probably advised you do connect if you can as I'm hearing stories that the version 1.1 patch is already live.

Sony wont, you dont even need to sign in to PSN just have an active internet on your PS3 but Microsoft did with Modern Warfare 2, but not 3, so if you got it, I'd play it! I just hate waiting til I can hopefully go grab it tommorow and squeeze in time to play it!