Have Bethesda learned any lessons from Skyrim's pre-release?

[Yaxsis]

but I have no problem waiting 8 more days

That is what they all say... BWAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHA !

No but seriously, I agree with you fully! I haven't seen anything other than the material Bethesda has put out !

[Pobatti]

Well, the fact that Bethesda shipped out copies of the full game to everyone in the media last week might have something to do with it. Maybe in the future they could, toy know, not do that.

Not just reviewers. The moment the game went gold, the race would already be on to get the game shipped out to distribution centres worldwide, who are then responsible for shipping to individual retailers within their catchment area.

Having worked in a UK distribution centre myself for a short period (temporary agency position to assist with the pre-Christmas rush) I can say from first hand you have a situation where about 200 or so young temping staff have access to copious copies of the game. The particular centrer I worked at had heavy security at the door, but people still succeeded in smuggling stuff out in various bizarre ways.

On top of that, the staff were allowed to take an order sheet, and during lunch break they could go around the shelves noting down the product numbers of various products. We would then hand the slip in to the 'staff cash' office, who would get a member of staff to go around 'picking' the order - and we'd collect it at the end of the day before finishing work, with a full receipt so the security knew we didn't actually steal any of the stuff we were carrying out.

We'd pay the same price the retailers did - which was needless to say, quite a bit less with no VAT

That particular DC had no policy concerning staff sales of unreleased titles. Their exemption (allowing them to trade with other retailers before the release date) had a loophole where they were able to treat the staff themselves in exactly the same way.

[Yaxsis]

The particular centrer I worked at had heavy security at the door,

For some reason I imagined the Imperial Legion standing there !
What better protection for a Elder Scrolls game than the Imperial Legion!
But yeah, your explanation seems to explain a lot :/

[dorian2]

Well, the fact that Bethesda shipped out copies of the full game to everyone in the media last week might have something to do with it. Maybe in the future they could, toy know, not do that.

Not just reviewers. The moment the game went gold, the race would already be on to get the game shipped out to distribution centres worldwide, who are then responsible for shipping to individual retailers within their catchment area.

Having worked in a UK distribution centre myself for a short period (temporary agency position to assist with the pre-Christmas rush) I can say from first hand you have a situation where about 200 or so young temping staff have access to copious copies of the game. The particular centrer I worked at had heavy security at the door, but people still succeeded in smuggling stuff out in various bizarre ways.

On top of that, the staff were allowed to take an order sheet, and during lunch break they could go around the shelves noting down the product numbers of various products. We would then hand the slip in to the 'staff cash' office, who would get a member of staff to go around 'picking' the order - and we'd collect it at the end of the day before finishing work, with a full receipt so the security knew we didn't actually steal any of the stuff we were carrying out.

We'd pay the same price the retailers did - which was needless to say, quite a bit less with no VAT

That particular DC had no policy concerning staff sales of unreleased titles. Their exemption (allowing them to trade with other retailers before the release date) had a loophole where they were able to treat the staff themselves in exactly the same way.

Great post! I think people tend to forget that their are probably thousands of employees at these centers across the world that either want to get something before everyone else, or, more likely, get something that they can make a quick buck on.

As someone in the general public that buys games legally, it seldom crosses my mind that there are thousands of games having to be shippped and distributed on a certain date. It certainly doesn't happen by magic or an unusual vortex in the galaxy.

And as far as alot of leaks, i'm pretty sure the game companies, epecially the big guys like Beth, have the leakage down to a science. They know how people think and probably have a team of leak professionals at their disposal.

[Wolfie]

It's clear that Bethesda wanted to control the content that the public got to see concerning Skyrim right up to the release on 11.11.11 (most games companies do), but clearly something went wrong somewhere along the line:

all games are like this

- The entire intro was leaked onto the internet a few days ago
- There is a rumor that the entire game was leaked
- Over the last 24 hours there have been numerous live streams of people playing the game
- The soundtrack to the game has been posted to video hosting sites

See above

Now Bethesda is doing it's best to control the situation - they're pulling media down very quickly. The problem is, media is popping right back up just as fast (if not faster) than Bethesda can remove it, and the material that is being posted is getting steadily worse as time goes on - people are actually hosting live streaming of themselves playing the game. It's gotten so bad that the Vice President of Bethesda, Pete Hines' own Twitter account could easily be used as a reliable source of leak URLs since so many people report them to him and the messages are visible for the world to see.

Again lot of games like this

I've never, ever, known a situation get so out of control as this.

my guess is you have not followed a game so closerly before

Now, these sort of things can happen with any popular game. The problem is made worse by the fact that:

- The game is just so exceptionally popular (there will always be someone breaking the rules/law)
- Not a great deal of information was officially released - which was tightly controlled by Bethesda
- Absolutely no information about the PS3 version, only the PC version specs are known
- No playable demo

I simply can't understand why Bethesda could sit on a great game like this and not allow the public to reach their own conclusions - I'm not saying we should all get the game early, but maybe a bit more than we have been given this time around would go a long way to preventing the sort of problems that Skyrim has faced (or at least reduce the damage somewhat).

even when demos come out pepole still do this, it would change nothing

Little information leads to paranoia. Paranoia leads to far more interest in leaks than usual - leaks that are low in quality and badly represent the game. Low quality footage puts a lot of people off (one of the biggest concerns) and can overturn the hype machine overnight as soon as the 'this game looks bad' ball starts rolling.

Any proof for this claim

Given the way Elder Scrolls games (and their 'family' including Fallout 3 and similar) are designed, it should be as easy as pie to make a demonstration 'dungeon' that contains ways to try out many of the skills the game has to offer. People would then be able to see the version of the game they're wanting to pre-order before the fact, nobody gets paranoid, bad quality footage has much less impact and people are better able to judge their purchase on release day - unlike PS3 owners who are basically forced to 'pay and pray' if they have any interest in the game at all.

Oblivion had a demo thing they used, when pepole found out that it was not in game, they fliped out.

Surely with a demo, at least half the people Googling for leaked material (or even 'keeping it up' on the hosting sites) would be too busy enjoying actually playing a short 10-20 minute demo to bother with all this stuff. And any leaks would lose value.

How did you come up with this? it would only stop them for 10-20 minute maybe more if they replaye it

I know we have screenshots, and certain 'edited' footage has been officially released - but I'm sensing major paranoia from the main game forums, GameFaqs message board and a bunch of other places. Many people think that the footage we're getting is being 'vetted' in such a way as to misrepresent the product. An odd couple of glitches spotted in the opening 10 minutes of the game (such as the sliding guard) did nothing to ease those concerns - and in fact made even more people paranoid.

its the nature of the beast, Skyrim is geting a LOT of hype, any one will freak out its not up to the hype, leaks or no

So, when all is said and done, do you think Bethesda learned any lessons from this experience? Might we see the future releases of the rumored Fallout 4 (and even further in the future, Elder Scrolls 6) handled differently? Since many of the leaks seem to have originated purely as a result of the overwhelming need by the community to 'see' a bit more than they were getting,

There is a saying, no mater what you get you need more, even if they gave us 99.9% of the game that .1 would be leaked cause someone needs to see it

It's too late for Skyrim, but as far as any future game is concerned - if a demo is out of the picture, what else could Bethesda feasibly do to keep their fan-base sufficiently content but eager, so people remain excited about the game but don't end up getting frustrated or paranoid near release? What sort of strategies do other games companies employ to reduce the need for people to go out and repeatedly leak material or for others to view it and pass the links along?

Look at all games, the awnser is nothing, you cant stop it really, you release a deom someone will hack in and find out more of the real game
ect

[Kestral]

The amount of leakage, or perhaps fervor for new information, is easily satiated by even the tiniest bit flurry of the skirt of the game developer. I'd like to use Battlefield 3 as an example. We got a demo of the game, and much more information than we have Skyrim. There wasn't a leak of the game, and people were coolly satisfied with it as well.

Bethesda has been very tight-lipped about it, with most information coming by in scant quantities in gaming magazines and 3rd party gaming websites. Its hard to determine multiple fonts of information on Skyrim directly from Bethesda. They've been playing the teasing game more than anything as well. Live action trailer, the occasional screenshot, and the one video of publicly released gaming footage. That lack of information most likely lead to increased hype, and more leaks. In contrast, Battlefied (which had a lot of hype) but with a much less amount of hunger for information as Skyrim.

[Wolfie]

Uhh you sure there was no leak for Battlefield 3?
I seem to recall one or two... may be the wrong game

[Kestral]

Uhh you sure there was no leak for Battlefield 3?
I seem to recall one or two... may be the wrong game

A quick search has revealed some leakage, an .iso file of the PC version roughly a week before release. The rumor isn't very strong, however, a leakage is inevitable with any game. Skyrim got much more leakage, as in with an actual video of the game being released not from Bethesda, and the main theme.

[Wolfie]

and if you where to search for the leaks before the game came out? there would be more

they took them down and by the tiem the game came out no one botherd putting them back up

[Kestral]

and if you where to search for the leaks before the game came out? there would be more

they took them down and by the tiem the game came out no one botherd putting them back up

A quick search showed the one torrent released a week before the game has surged in popularity, but there was only one or two other popular torrents that were released before the release date, and even then, they either might be direct copies of the older torrent or were released a day or so before release.

[Wolfie]

Those are still up, how many where taken down?

The point is, did Skyrim have a bit more? yeah sure but I'm chalking it up to the fact that evrey one wants it

and the fact that Beth is not the most secure compony in the first place

Would a demo or more detials help? maybe with who veiws the leaks but with who sends them on the web? i dont think so

[Kestral]

Those are still up, how many where taken down?

The point is, did Skyrim have a bit more? yeah sure but I'm chalking it up to the fact that evrey one wants it

and the fact that Beth is not the most secure compony in the first place

Would a demo or more detials help? maybe with who veiws the leaks but with who sends them on the web? i dont think so

Well, of course there are going to be leaks, but first off, who is actually viewing and or using the leak is what matters here.
Firstly, even among the most popular torrent sites, the torrent isn't very popular. It is evident that all of the torrents came from the same original download, but, currently, less than 200 people are using the most popular one now. And that is with a hyped game like Skyrim.

Perhaps the normal gamer and the hardcore gamer, the ones who'd do this, are unrelated in terms of satiation for information. But it does seem apparent that the other leaked content, such as the video and (full) soundtrack are proving to be more popular.

[Lynx2069]

Well, the fact that Bethesda shipped out copies of the full game to everyone in the media last week might have something to do with it. Maybe in the future they could, toy know, not do that.

Not just reviewers. The moment the game went gold, the race would already be on to get the game shipped out to distribution centres worldwide, who are then responsible for shipping to individual retailers within their catchment area.

Having worked in a UK distribution centre myself for a short period (temporary agency position to assist with the pre-Christmas rush) I can say from first hand you have a situation where about 200 or so young temping staff have access to copious copies of the game. The particular centrer I worked at had heavy security at the door, but people still succeeded in smuggling stuff out in various bizarre ways.

On top of that, the staff were allowed to take an order sheet, and during lunch break they could go around the shelves noting down the product numbers of various products. We would then hand the slip in to the 'staff cash' office, who would get a member of staff to go around 'picking' the order - and we'd collect it at the end of the day before finishing work, with a full receipt so the security knew we didn't actually steal any of the stuff we were carrying out.

We'd pay the same price the retailers did - which was needless to say, quite a bit less with no VAT

That particular DC had no policy concerning staff sales of unreleased titles. Their exemption (allowing them to trade with other retailers before the release date) had a loophole where they were able to treat the staff themselves in exactly the same way.

Good Point. Its not just the press who has it but distributers and retailers soon.

I think the reason PC versions haven't been seen is because they are far easier to pirate then X360.

As for the PS3 version I'd say it may be related to the fact that BD disks are more diffucult to manufacture with most facilities in Asia. BD facilities are in far higher demand then DVD due to the increased production of BD movies and all the PS3 games coming out before Skyrim, like MW3.
Just dont let the PS3 version be inferior...

[Pobatti]

all games are like this

Usually, a multi platform game gets promoted equally across all platforms. In the event that one of the console manufacturers makes a promotion deal with the company, information, screenshots and footage of the other versions are usually available.

In this case, everything we've seen has been XBox360. People are dying to catch a glimpse of their version.

Again lot of games like this

Fair enough, but in this case people have it in their heads that since Bethesda seem to be purposefully only promoting the single platform, their only chance of getting any information about their version is from the leaks. People who wouldn't usually bother with leaks and such are joining in with the chaos and keeping an eye out for this stuff (myself included) for this very reason.

As soon as footage leaks, the first thing people start asking is "what platform is it?".

my guess is you have not followed a game so closerly before

Again, explained above. I've seen the chaos leaks can bring, but throw in another huge section of the gaming population with their own reasons to be excited by the leak ("is this my version?") and the situation gets much worse. In fact, as I said above, I don't usually watch leaked footage because of spoilers... yet I always do because I need to at least see the PS3 version.

even when demos come out pepole still do this, it would change nothing

Again, people don't seem to 'trust' Bethesda. Many folks point to previous buggy releases, while others are regularly quoting statements from the development team and then attempt to prove they're lies. Since there were so many glitches in Oblivion and Fallout 3, many people look at the officially released footage with a degree of suspicion and start to think that footage is vetted. The leaked intro proved that, to a point.

All over the internet, even on the official forums, people were very quick to jump to the conclusion that Bethesda are hiding the PS3 and PC versions because they have more glitches than the 360 version - and so are expecting people to put real money on the table before anyone finds out how much of a quality conversion they'll be getting.

I recall several games that were perfectly fine on the 360, but were a mess of glitches and continual crashes on the PS3 - if I remember correctly "Assassin's Creed" was one of them... clearly ported from the XBox360 but not very stable on initial release.

A demo could alleviate all those concerns.

Any proof for this claim

No proof per-se. I had this experience over on the GameFaqs board, as well as the official Bethesda site. People would start a topic about how Bethesda are lying about this, or withholding that, or treating one third of their potential buyers like royalty compared to the other two who are supposed to just sit and take their word for it that a PS3 version even exists.

To begin with, people begin passing links to people who specifically ask them ("here you go, keep it under your hat").

On occasion, you get someone who's so disgruntled by Bethesda that they will openly admit to constantly re-uploading the video just to annoy Bethesda as a form of protest. A couple of others also decide to do the same, next thing you know, just by posting a reply in one of those topics you end up with about a dozen PM's in your mail saying "we'll teach them: (new link)".

When this sort of PM/upload/link battle takes place, it's clear what people's motivations are.

Oblivion had a demo thing they used, when pepole found out that it was not in game, they fliped out.

You'll always get people who find reason to complain. The problem is, by not giving us a chance to evaluate the general quality of the game and how certain features work, far more people (not just the usual trolls) will be complaining, getting paranoid and posting their thoughts - which simply compounds the situation. I don't create topics like "the grafix suxx" or "it's too dark" or anything like the regular trolls post - but I am genuinely concerned for both the PC and PS3 versions, and plenty of others will have plenty of reason to be.

How did you come up with this? it would only stop them for 10-20 minute maybe more if they replaye it

In one of the replies you thought I hadn't followed a game so closely before. I have, in fact. I'm now 33 and have been playing games since the age of 5. There have been many games I've been just as fanatical (occasionally more so) over the course of that time - yet you have a point. Several major releases could have had similar situations occur - but I was too busy playing the demo to notice.

Many people following the leaks just want to see the game running on their machine. A demo would do that. These people will continue to seek out new leaks until they find footage that can be confirmed is their version of the game. That's why I look out for people posting URLS in various places. I don't want to spoil myself - but it's the only way I can scratch that itch.

its the nature of the beast, Skyrim is geting a LOT of hype, any one will freak out its not up to the hype, leaks or no

Again, true - however you have to admit that seeing the game first hand, or maybe having some actual footage of the other versions released will go a long way to stopping these "your version will look worse because we're the lead console" arguments, or people actually honestly believing 320p footage with bad compression accurately represents the game. Comparing the real thing between versions is fair - comparing low quality footage of one version to make-believe 'it must be even worse' unseen versions is a huge problem at the moment.

There is a saying, no mater what you get you need more, even if they gave us 99.9% of the game that .1 would be leaked cause someone needs to see it

Yes. This is true because there's always one. The thing is, if I had even 10 minutes of the game to play as a demo, if I saw a topic titled "new footage leaked!" or "live gameplay stream!" I'd just not care too much. They could only possibly serve to spoil since I can run through a 10 minute demo and actually play it, that's what I'd prefer to do. If people were less interested in the leaks overall there would be fewer people keeping the leaked footage 'alive' and Bethesda might stand a better chance getting it pulled.

Of course the software leaks are a different kettle of fish and exist for the same reason they always do...

Look at all games, the awnser is nothing, you cant stop it really, you release a deom someone will hack in and find out more of the real game

No they wouldn't. If a person did hack the demo, all they'd succeed in doing is a great big nothing! It's not like Bethesda would ship the demo with the entire great big ESM file packaged in. If the demo only includes one dungeon, it only includes one dungeon. Since the construction kit isn't even out, people couldn't mod that. It's also easy enough to do just enough tinkering on the EXE to make it completely incompatible with ESM/ESP files that are not made in a specific (non standard) way.

Now the only problem really is that you'd have an EXE that doesn't require STEAM to run. Big deal - it won't run the actual full game in place of the distributed EXE of the retail product without a great deal of hacking, and if people are going to do that then the retail EXE isn't exactly a secure target either.

[SuperNull]

Pobatti, has it occurred to you that maybe Beth is not doing a demo for marketing reasons? The more uncertain people are about something the more they talk about it, the more publicity something gets.
Some say it is better for sales to not have a demo. Just google for "game demo bad for sales".

[Pobatti]

Pobatti, has it occurred to you that maybe Beth is not doing a demo for marketing reasons? The more uncertain people are about something the more they talk about it, the more publicity something gets.
Some say it is better for sales to not have a demo. Just google for "game demo bad for sales".

There's a saying - any publicity is good publicity.

You have a point, but when it comes to people actually getting a bit concerned over how well deserved the game is over their hard earned £50 you have a situation where all this publicity is actually spreading the rot. Everywhere you go, there are posts on forums such as these basically saying...

"ho hum, I've cancelled my pre-order. I'm going to sit it out and wait until the game comes out. Then I'm going to do visit a few forums and see what people are talking about before I hand over my money."

So for every person that does this, the game loses a 'first day' customer. Such a person may get the game at a later date, or they may just decide to get one of the other two games that people keep comparing Skyrim to. Even if a person did come back to garner popular opinion from the 'experts' on the message boards - what will he see? Trolls. And people who had technical issues, and heck - maybe the game is a massive glitch/crash fest for all we know.

The problem is, people aren't going out in the middle of the town square, or on national televison, and bringing up the game. They mainly just badmouth the game in forum topics full of people who are already excited about the game, and each negative comment - if anything at all - can only push their interest the other way.

[argom4g3]

I subscibe to the Game reviewers leaked it conspiracy theory.
The Demo idea is "bad" imo
Bethesda has released a few good titles in the past, my experience
with their past games has been very enjoyable. they will satisfy my
gamming addiction 111111 no doubt.........


As stated b4 RPGs are not mainstream & if U R so concerned with graphics
go mainstream & don't worry about the micromanagement of your avatar.
this game will bore you.

[Wolfie]

Fair enough, but in this case people have it in their heads that since Bethesda seem to be purposefully only promoting the single platform, their only chance of getting any information about their version is from the leaks. People who wouldn't usually bother with leaks and such are joining in with the chaos and keeping an eye out for this stuff (myself included) for this very reason.

Because you want a peak at the game?
Maybe some but I know manythat avoid everything like the plague so I think it evens out

As soon as footage leaks, the first thing people start asking is "what platform is it?".

The only time platform would come in to play would be
A. some glitches that would be in mid game that you would not see in a demo
and
B graphics
The way the spells work, weapons hit, talking ect
gose on is the same

Again, explained above. I've seen the chaos leaks can bring, but throw in another huge section of the gaming population with their own reasons to be excited by the leak ("is this my version?") and the situation gets much worse. In fact, as I said above, I don't usually watch leaked footage because of spoilers... yet I always do because I need to at least see the PS3 version.

Why do you need to?
What will be so deferent form 360 to ps3?

Again, people don't seem to 'trust' Bethesda. Many folks point to previous buggy releases

You can NOT have a non buggy sand box game, its just not possible

while others are regularly quoting statements from the development team and then attempt to prove they're lies. Since there were so many glitches in Oblivion and Fallout 3, many people look at the officially released footage with a degree of suspicion and start to think that footage is vetted. The leaked intro proved that, to a point.

Yes they wont tell you bout the glitches, if you worried about glitches let me tell you, they will be in there, there will be loads of them
It will most likely be incompletely for a few months

All over the internet, even on the official forums, people were very quick to jump to the conclusion that Bethesda are hiding the PS3 and PC versions because they have more glitches than the 360 version

Highly unlikely, as for PC they can mod them out so they should not really care, as for the ps3, with oblivion there where a few problems ut IIRC it did not oringaly come out for the ps3
Even then if oblivion is proof then remember the gltichs where mostly Quest related, things you would not get in demo

I recall several games that were perfectly fine on the 360, but were a mess of glitches and continual crashes on the PS3 - if I remember correctly "Assassin's Creed" was one of them... clearly ported from the XBox360 but not very stable on initial release.

None of beth's games are stable on initial release, even on 360

A demo could alleviate all those concerns.

How so? they have people play the games at places and thats not enough, they set a limit to how much you can do, no mather how they do the demo ALL of the problems will still be threre

No proof per-se. I had this experience over on the GameFaqs board, as well as the official Bethesda site. People would start a topic about how Bethesda are lying about this, or withholding that, or treating one third of their potential buyers like royalty compared to the other two who are supposed to just sit and take their word for it that a PS3 version even exists.

Again pepole would find a way to complain even if they did
If they showed them the ps3 part they will want to see evrey quest, and then will complain till they find out if they get dlc or not

On occasion, you get someone who's so disgruntled by Bethesda that they will openly admit to constantly re-uploading the video just to annoy Bethesda as a form of protest. A couple of others also decide to do the same, next thing you know, just by posting a reply in one of those topics you end up with about a dozen PM's in your mail saying "we'll teach them: (new link)".

And it dont teach them a darn thing and is pretty imature.
If anything leaks may help, as people will buy the game.

You'll always get people who find reason to complain. The problem is, by not giving us a chance to evaluate the general quality of the game and how certain features work, far more people (not just the usual trolls) will be complaining, getting paranoid and posting their thoughts - which simply compounds the situation

There are plenty of people who have played the game, is that not good enough? why not? its a demo?
because every one wants to see the whole game and now.

I don't create topics like "the grafix suxx" or "it's too dark" or anything like the regular trolls post - but I am genuinely concerned for both the PC and PS3 versions, and plenty of others will have plenty of reason to be.

Like? Again
the big difference form the three systems is graphics, a few others but most of those can not be answered with a demo
dose the ps3 have so many broken quest as it did in oblivion?
cant awnser with a demo
will the ps3 have all the Dlc? cant awsner with demo ect

In one of the replies you thought I hadn't followed a game so closely before. I have, in fact. I'm now 33 and have been playing games since the age of 5. There have been many games I've been just as fanatical (occasionally more so) over the course of that time - yet you have a point. Several major releases could have had similar situations occur - but I was too busy playing the demo to notice.

You may have been but your not one of those pepole who got out and gets leaked stuff, those who do would not be stoped

Many people following the leaks just want to see the game running on their machine. A demo would do that.

Why just see it? what posibley will be so defreint form the three?
I’m thinking you have the wrong idea, I’ve been to a lot of leaked thins and yes there are some about ps3 and pc but most are about
Werewolfs, spells, storyline, music ect

These people will continue to seek out new leaks until they find footage that can be confirmed is their version of the game. That's why I look out for people posting URLS in various places. I don't want to spoil myself - but it's the only way I can scratch that itch.

Idk bout you but most leaks are about vampires, and story line, and music
not to many of the "demos"out there are being downloaded so I'm guessing your wrong

Again, true - however you have to admit that seeing the game first hand, or maybe having some actual footage of the other versions released will go a long way to stopping these "your version will look worse because we're the lead console" arguments

I'll might give you that
but i dont think it will stop leaks

or people actually honestly believing 320p footage with bad compression accurately represents the game.

anyone who thinks this will most likely sitll thinks this.

Comparing the real thing between versions is fair - comparing low quality footage of one version to make-believe 'it must be even worse' unseen versions is a huge problem at the moment.

Would a demo solve that? Maybe, but as been said
if your playing TES for graphics your in the wrong place
And has been said when has any game on the ps3 not had better graphics then on 360?
Or if not atleast the same?
As far as i know oblvion looked the same form 360 to ps3
while pc was better
Is there any LOICAL reason not to believe it this time?

Yes. This is true because there's always one. The thing is, if I had even 10 minutes of the game to play as a demo, if I saw a topic titled "new footage leaked!" or "live gameplay stream!" I'd just not care too much.

your one of the Rare ones. Most pepole who watch leaks are in it for as much infmation as they can get.

They could only possibly serve to spoil since I can run through a 10 minute demo and actually play it, that's what I'd prefer to do. If people were less interested in the leaks overall there would be fewer people keeping the leaked footage 'alive' and Bethesda might stand a better chance getting it pulled.
Of course the software leaks are a different kettle of fish and exist for the same reason they always do...

Again I think more then half the pepole who do it, dont do it for this reason.
And we agree on the 2nd part

[No they wouldn't. If a person did hack the demo, all they'd succeed in doing is a great big nothing! It's not like Bethesda would ship the demo with the entire great big ESM file packaged in.

My point was theyt get the demo they would want it more
If the Demo is awesome then they want more infmation
"is the demo anything like the finished copy?
"What could I have doe with that item i did not get to use?
"Dose this happen?"
ect
there would be more questions and I belive more reasson to look for leaks

If the demo only includes one dungeon, it only includes one dungeon. Since the construction kit isn't even out, people couldn't mod that. It's also easy enough to do just enough tinkering on the EXE to make it completely incompatible with ESM/ESP files that are not made in a specific (non standard) way.
Now the only problem really is that you'd have an EXE that doesn't require STEAM to run. Big deal - it won't run the actual full game in place of the distributed EXE of the retail product without a great deal of hacking, and if people are going to do that then the retail EXE isn't exactly a secure target either.

And if they did this people would again still look for leaked imation as this demo might be pulling the wool over us.
You have some points but I stand by the idea that if they did it would not help at the most be worse at the worst