Lore General Discussion!

A place to discuss and ask questions about anything related to the Elder Scrolls lore.
giskard
Apprentice
Apprentice
Posts: 142
Joined: Fri Jul 08, 2011 9:43 am
ES Games: Morrowind, Oblivion
Platform: PC
Status: Active
Location: England
Contact:

Re: Want to know what everybody's talking about?

Post by giskard »

PS The Kvatch Arena in Oblivion Myth comes from the burned out ruins of one seen in kvatch at the start of Oblivion. So the arena is already past tense before you escape from prision. Like Tiber Septim, it is a thing of the past when the game starts.
A creative man is motivated by the desire to achieve, not by the desire to beat others. Ayn Rand
User avatar
Trelares
Master
Master
Posts: 1374
Joined: Mon Dec 13, 2010 12:52 pm
ES Games: Morrowind, Oblivion, Skyrim
Platform: PC
Status: ...
Location: Vienna, Austria (and no we have no Kangaroos!)

Re: Want to know what everybody's talking about?

Post by Trelares »

Lore is always kind of interpretation. One thread in the Lore Section that show that very good is the discussion about Lorkhan and the creation of Nirn, where we discussed how much of Mankars crazy speech could be true. It was a nice thread^^.

And the second thing is people should always remember that Bethesda sometimes need to bend their lore, to make the game intime and "fair".
Kinsman, House Hlaalu

RFC 5513
OblivionDuruza
Grand Master
Grand Master
Posts: 6881
Joined: Tue Apr 19, 2011 7:44 am
UESPoints: 5

Re: Want to know what everybody's talking about?

Post by OblivionDuruza »

That's true, I always wonder about different interpretations. Part of the openness of the lore is because it's easier on development, but another aspect is that The Elder Scrolls are all about letting the player shape the game. Therefore, the player shapes the lore.
giskard
Apprentice
Apprentice
Posts: 142
Joined: Fri Jul 08, 2011 9:43 am
ES Games: Morrowind, Oblivion
Platform: PC
Status: Active
Location: England
Contact:

Re: Want to know what everybody's talking about?

Post by giskard »

Yup, that is also why they tend to advance time between each game or destroy old worlds like Morrowind. It stops them having to worry about it in the next game if its history already.

Which is good for game developers but not so hot for lore fans.
A creative man is motivated by the desire to achieve, not by the desire to beat others. Ayn Rand
User avatar
Sloady
Warder
Warder
Posts: 589
Joined: Sat Apr 23, 2011 8:50 pm
ES Games: Daggerfall, Oblivion, Shivering Isles, Skyrim
Platform: PC
Status: AFK since 2011

Re: Want to know what everybody's talking about?

Post by Sloady »

The Lore is the only reason I bought the games. I fell in love with the Tolkien like depth of TES.
I'm on a rollercoaster that only goes up
Chaos the N'wah wrote:TRAMPY!
Founding member of the Weasel Forums Universe
giskard
Apprentice
Apprentice
Posts: 142
Joined: Fri Jul 08, 2011 9:43 am
ES Games: Morrowind, Oblivion
Platform: PC
Status: Active
Location: England
Contact:

Re: Want to know what everybody's talking about?

Post by giskard »

TheNightFather wrote:The Lore is the only reason I bought the games. I fell in love with the Tolkien like depth of TES.
Personally I would not compare the lore those 2.
TES lore is not strong enough to match Tolken.

Interestingly, you know the Lord of the Rings films, except for the missing songs, if you pay attention, you will notice that most key lore points are present in the films but you have to be paying attention to spot them. I thought that was kind of nice to see.

Attention to detail and all that.
A creative man is motivated by the desire to achieve, not by the desire to beat others. Ayn Rand
User avatar
ronenum
Journeyman
Journeyman
Posts: 237
Joined: Tue Feb 16, 2010 5:30 am
ES Games: Dagger Fall (somewhat), Morrowind, Oblivion, Skyrim
Platform: PC and Xbox 360
Status: Enjoying my Coffee

Re: Want to know what everybody's talking about?

Post by ronenum »

Ah, the lore section...been a member here on the forums for quite a while now but have been visiting the lore section of our wiki much longer. go team. 8)
The unexamined life is not worth living
AddictedtoMorrowind
Grand Master
Grand Master
Posts: 2470
Joined: Tue Aug 09, 2011 4:33 pm
UESPoints: 4

Re: Want to know what everybody's talking about?

Post by AddictedtoMorrowind »

Oh my gosh... the lore is a big part of what makes TES games(Morrowind specifically) awesome. I love the Lore stuff.
User avatar
Fist
Layman
Layman
Posts: 4
Joined: Sat Jan 15, 2011 11:55 pm
ES Games: Morrowind, Oblivion & DLCs, Skyrim
Platform: Xbox, Xbox 360, PC

Re: Want to know what everybody's talking about?

Post by Fist »

Do you guys have any suggestions on how to navigate the Lore section? I decided the best way to start was with History, but I pretty much just open every blue word, that I feel that I don't know much about, into a new tab. So I end up with 50+ tabs of stuff to read and every new tab brings more things to learn! But it's in a random order that probably isn't that best for learning it.

So how should I go about learning the lore?
Obsessed
OblivionDuruza
Grand Master
Grand Master
Posts: 6881
Joined: Tue Apr 19, 2011 7:44 am
UESPoints: 5

Re: Want to know what everybody's talking about?

Post by OblivionDuruza »

Hmm, depends on what you're interested in. For a general overview of the history of the world, you should go through the timeline of events, starting here. Looking into each races background is also a good idea, as the race pages are some of the best on the Wiki, IMO. Keeping up with these major events and with the inhabitants of Tamriel will give you a fairly good base from which to span out from.
User avatar
Fist
Layman
Layman
Posts: 4
Joined: Sat Jan 15, 2011 11:55 pm
ES Games: Morrowind, Oblivion & DLCs, Skyrim
Platform: Xbox, Xbox 360, PC

Re: Want to know what everybody's talking about?

Post by Fist »

Yeah, I decided I should like: Go through the whole timeline, then read about each race, then read about specific people.

Instead of my usual system of just reading through any random article.
Obsessed
Crimea River
Layman
Layman
Posts: 9
Joined: Sun Dec 25, 2011 4:48 am
ES Games: Daggerfall, Battlespire, Redguard, Morrowind, Oblivion, Skyrim
Platform: PC, X-Box 360

Re: Want to know what everybody's talking about?

Post by Crimea River »

UESP is excellent for lore (and Imperial-Library for in-game books), and I love how it's got its lore section separate from the gaming section. I didn't realise the existence of this lore main page until I saw this post on here, but I've been reading the lore pages for quite a while.

I've been reading in this order: timeline, races & their respective nations/provinces, religion. And then going back and looking at what those link to to get a better understanding of them. The lore is so extensive but I love it and feel inspired each time I read it. ^_^

I remember when I first played Oblivion. And then when I played it after having soaked up a lot of lore. More enjoyable and understandable that second time. :3
User avatar
Caligula
Novice
Novice
Posts: 97
Joined: Fri Jan 06, 2012 4:10 pm
ES Games: Morrowind GOTY, Oblivion, Skyrim
Platform: PC
Location: USA

Re: Want to know what everybody's talking about?

Post by Caligula »

I love the lore of TES. I knew the game was very in-depth when I first started playing, but I didn't realize how massive the historical data is.

I do have a question though. Are there any available pictures of Tsaesci? I have never seen one of these vampiric "snake people".
Check out my music:
soundcloud.com/matricalmusic
Lady Nerevar
Novice
Novice
Posts: 55
Joined: Mon Dec 26, 2011 12:28 am
ES Games: Skyrim, Oblivion GOTY, Morrowind GOTY, Daggerfall, Arena
Platform: PC

Re: Want to know what everybody's talking about?

Post by Lady Nerevar »

Caligula wrote:Are there any available pictures of Tsaesci? I have never seen one of these vampiric "snake people".
Nothing official. There's plenty of fan art, but everyone has a slightly different interpretation.
User avatar
Caligula
Novice
Novice
Posts: 97
Joined: Fri Jan 06, 2012 4:10 pm
ES Games: Morrowind GOTY, Oblivion, Skyrim
Platform: PC
Location: USA

Re: Want to know what everybody's talking about?

Post by Caligula »

Damn...well I'll just check out the fan art. I wish there would be something from Bethesda though. Actually I wish there were many lands or races that were drawn up, that are never seen or explored.
Check out my music:
soundcloud.com/matricalmusic
Chrollo
Layman
Layman
Posts: 1
Joined: Mon Jan 09, 2012 3:39 pm
ES Games: Skyrim
Platform: PC

Re: Want to know what everybody's talking about?

Post by Chrollo »

I didn't want to make a thread for a single question, so I thought I'd just ask here:
I just want to confirm, Barenziah had how many children? One unborn with Tiber Septim, two with Symmachus, one with Nightingale, and a son with Jagar Tharn? The rest with Eadwyre, that doesn't matter -- but Dralsi is Karliah's mother, and Karliah is a nightingale of the Thieves' Guild, anyway, what I am really going to ask is, Dralsi came before Helseth and Morgiah, is that correct? But they aren't sure if she's Nightingale's or Symmachus's daughter so they sent her away?
Well I just read The Real Barenziah 10 part version and The Nightingales and got confused
User avatar
Swampy
Journeyman
Journeyman
Posts: 321
Joined: Sun Jan 08, 2012 7:14 pm
ES Games: Oblivion,Skyrim
Platform: PS3

Re: Want to know what everybody's talking about?

Post by Swampy »

Just a quick Question.
I cant find any wiki articles about the Argonian and the Dunmer war.
Could someone link them?
War. War never changes.
ArgonianDunmer
Warder
Warder
Posts: 561
Joined: Tue Sep 06, 2011 6:48 am
ES Games: Oblivion, Daggerfall, Morrowind, Skyrim
Status: Ash Poet awaiting the return of the Dagoths
Location: Kogoruhn

Re: Want to know what everybody's talking about?

Post by ArgonianDunmer »

I don't think you can find them because I don't think there are any.
The Imperial Purple of the CPM
Veck wrote:I'd hardly say it's the best thing in Maths anyway. It sure beats surds, but most calculator maths isn't passionate enough to be cool.
OblivionDuruza
Grand Master
Grand Master
Posts: 6881
Joined: Tue Apr 19, 2011 7:44 am
UESPoints: 5

Re: Want to know what everybody's talking about?

Post by OblivionDuruza »

There really isn't much info on the Invasion of Morrowind or its aftermath. There are two small 'articles' you might be interested in though, The Arnesian War and The Second Arnesian War. Hopefully they will be expanded in the future, particularly if we learn more about the specifics and nature of the conflicts.
User avatar
Pilaf The Defiler
Imperial Legate
Imperial Legate
Posts: 4359
Joined: Sat Nov 26, 2011 9:03 pm
ES Games: Arena, Daggerfall, Morrowind, Oblivion, Skyrim, ESO
Platform: PC, Xbox, Xbox 360
Status: Fresh
UESPoints: 20

Re: Want to know what everybody's talking about?

Post by Pilaf The Defiler »

Swampy wrote:Just a quick Question.
I cant find any wiki articles about the Argonian and the Dunmer war.
Could someone link them?

Wasn't really much of a war to be honest. It was more like the Argonians seizing an opportunity to route the Dunmer, who were already confused and demoralized.

You might wanna check out the two novels by Keyes, or read a certain note found in Skyrim. These are the primary sources of info about what happened. Not much is known at all. I think the Argonians caught them off guard and drove them out pretty quickly, but didn't actually stay and occupy Morrowind for the most part. Maybe the southernmost areas near the border.
Monsters are bred in labyrinths, labyrinths are bred from walls. There is a reason the Giants choose to remain nomadic rather than follow their shield kin the Nords in building permanent settlements. The Tower is the beginning of all walls.
Velothi
Champion
Champion
Posts: 803
Joined: Mon Jul 11, 2011 10:47 pm
ES Games: Morrowind Game of the Year Edition (PC), Oblivion Game of the Year edition
Platform: Playstation 3, PC

Re: Want to know what everybody's talking about?

Post by Velothi »

OblivionDuruza wrote:There really isn't much info on the Invasion of Morrowind or its aftermath. There are two small 'articles' you might be interested in though, The Arnesian War and The Second Arnesian War. Hopefully they will be expanded in the future, particularly if we learn more about the specifics and nature of the conflicts.
That is totally my term.


Copy-right Velothi :U

Though honestly think of the second Arnesian War to the re-occupation of old territory taken by the Dres.

The Argonians just took back what they wanted, land that was unjustly stolen by the Dres.
ArchMaster of The Great House of Redoran
"The Red Party of Redoran maintains Temple Traditions"
For a new Redoran in Solstheim, For Morrowind, Ancestors and Resdaynia!

High Lord of the Great House of Indoril and Lord of Almalexia

VVV
User avatar
Minor Edits
Champion
Champion
Posts: 819
Joined: Tue Apr 26, 2011 1:52 am
ES Games: Morrowind, Oblivion, Skyrim
Platform: Xbox 360
UESPoints: 10

Re: Want to know what everybody's talking about?

Post by Minor Edits »

Chrollo wrote:I didn't want to make a thread for a single question, so I thought I'd just ask here:
I just want to confirm, Barenziah had how many children? One unborn with Tiber Septim, two with Symmachus, one with Nightingale, and a son with Jagar Tharn? The rest with Eadwyre, that doesn't matter -- but Dralsi is Karliah's mother, and Karliah is a nightingale of the Thieves' Guild, anyway, what I am really going to ask is, Dralsi came before Helseth and Morgiah, is that correct? But they aren't sure if she's Nightingale's or Symmachus's daughter so they sent her away?
Well I just read The Real Barenziah 10 part version and The Nightingales and got confused
The one thing that can be agreed upon is that the truth was distorted. There's some contention that some or all of the salacious details of The Real Barenziah were fabricated to assist in this distortion; that the truth, whatever it actually was, was so politically inconvenient, and so dissociated from the official story, that they had to concoct a false alternative, thus leading people to conjecture on which of two false narratives was the "truth". So little can be truly and unequivocally confirmed. I think it's likely that some of the "truth" has never been revealed. But my best guess is that she had at least two kids, likely a third with a thief called the Nightingale (who was not Jagar Tharn), and there's an outside chance she had an aborted child with Septim. I'm not aware of any children with Eadwyre.
Br3admax wrote:This post is bad and it should feel bad.
User avatar
Caligula
Novice
Novice
Posts: 97
Joined: Fri Jan 06, 2012 4:10 pm
ES Games: Morrowind GOTY, Oblivion, Skyrim
Platform: PC
Location: USA

Re: Want to know what everybody's talking about?

Post by Caligula »

Velothi wrote:
OblivionDuruza wrote:There really isn't much info on the Invasion of Morrowind or its aftermath. There are two small 'articles' you might be interested in though, The Arnesian War and The Second Arnesian War. Hopefully they will be expanded in the future, particularly if we learn more about the specifics and nature of the conflicts.
That is totally my term.


Copy-right Velothi :U

Though honestly think of the second Arnesian War to the re-occupation of old territory taken by the Dres.

The Argonians just took back what they wanted, land that was unjustly stolen by the Dres.
This is true. The Argonians reclaimed their lost land...but, of course it would still be very interesting to hear in more detail about the conflicts.
Also, I would find it very appealing to find out how the reconstruction period progressed.
Check out my music:
soundcloud.com/matricalmusic
User avatar
Minor Edits
Champion
Champion
Posts: 819
Joined: Tue Apr 26, 2011 1:52 am
ES Games: Morrowind, Oblivion, Skyrim
Platform: Xbox 360
UESPoints: 10

Re: Want to know what everybody's talking about?

Post by Minor Edits »

Velothi wrote:
OblivionDuruza wrote:There really isn't much info on the Invasion of Morrowind or its aftermath. There are two small 'articles' you might be interested in though, The Arnesian War and The Second Arnesian War. Hopefully they will be expanded in the future, particularly if we learn more about the specifics and nature of the conflicts.
That is totally my term.


Copy-right Velothi :U

Though honestly think of the second Arnesian War to the re-occupation of old territory taken by the Dres.

The Argonians just took back what they wanted, land that was unjustly stolen by the Dres.
Thought I should point out that it looks like the "Accession War" is the proper name for the Argonian invasion of Morrowind, and we'll probably be editing the wiki to use that term. If you have strong feelings about that, it's being discussed here.
Br3admax wrote:This post is bad and it should feel bad.
User avatar
Talthios
Initiate
Initiate
Posts: 47
Joined: Fri Aug 17, 2012 8:38 pm
ES Games: Oblivion,Skyrim
Platform: Xbox360
Status: Probably daydreaming.
Location: Oklahoma

Re: Want to know what everybody's talking about?

Post by Talthios »

The lore on this game is truly awsome,If I was born in tamriel I so would of been a moth priest.
Post Reply