Least Useful Magic School

[grannas211]

As you guys know Im pretty new here and Im trying to create a magic based character. So I ask what you guys think is the most useless magic school. I know people have talked about the most useful. But I come to ask what you all think is the most useless. But as in anything in life if your going to ask a mass question, you should have an answer for yourself. My answer would be Mysticism. Its just a personal preference, but other than detect life, I dont see much out of this school.

[philayre]

No doubt has to be mysticism

absorb skills are pretty useless with most enemy stats too low to support much, its temporary and you need to keep in range to have it work (I never use it)

reflect spell is good but too expensive as a spell (not sure if your able to enchant your own gear with high skill)

dispel is also good, but just look out for the scroll equivalents (hardly ever used)

sense life is weak as a spell compared to Sigil stones, and over expensive in magicka

and soul trap effects are completely common as enchated weapons and scroll spells.

[azuarc]

I'm not convinced. I've taken Mysticism as a major just because I'd be casting Detect Life over and over. It's a very handy spell, and unless you have it on a good enchantment, you're going to want to know where you'll be attacked from. Soul Trap is also rather vital (and do you really want it as an on-hit effect, going off every time you strike, and requiring constant recharge?) Reflect spells are good, but too expensive. The rest is pretty crappy, I'll admit, but I'd put three other schools up before Mysticism.

Illusion is useful. Restoration is often necessary. I think you could make a legitimate call out of any of the other four.
* Philayre already made the case for mysticism.
* I've honestly never used Conjuration -- ever -- and I've played a lot of different characters. I feel like the summons are too short in duration to be effective, and expensive considering they will require recasts. The same goes for the armor. If you could actually create something permanent, like a Summon Arrows spell, I might change my tune.
* Alteration contains a lot of spells that are utilitarian, but hardly necessary. There isn't a single spell in Alteration I couldn't do without. Water Walking/Breathing is nice, but Feather as a spell suffers from the same problem as conjuration in that I'd want it active constantly. Burden can be funny at times, but is unreliable, so I'd rather use the expensive Paralyze. What does it say that I can't even think of the other effects? (I originally thought Light, but that's actually Illusion.)
* Ironically, Destruction is a legitimate candidate for the chopping block. Who would have thought something as simple and routine as causing damage would be "least useful," but Destruction damage is expensive. Target spells are even more expensive, and you could easily miss depending on how your target is behaving, but touch spells put you in harm's way, which a cloth-wearing mage isn't likely to desire. The fact that there are three different elements, and there aren't many enemies that are weak to any of them, makes Destruction useful as little more than a support activity to perform with your mana as an otherwise-mundane melee character.


Ultimately, if I have to choose, I'd go with Alteration. It's only purpose seems to be to pick as a major skill for ease in leveling. Casting a cheap Feather or Water Walking spell repeatedly while travelling can help progress your willpower, or simply your progress toward 10 points, and can safely say you won't advance it accidentally from over-usage. That's really all I ever use Alteration for. In that sense, it's more useful than Conjuration, which has expensive spells, or Destruction, which requires a target, but it honestly says something about a skill if your only reason to have it is to not use it.

[Siken]

Hehe i hear people whant mor spells but never taht they not need some spell!!

For exampel combine night eye spell whit telekinesis 100 ft for 1 sec on target, so you see in darck and see all obyect and creature neme in 100ft.
Combinate samon creature whit fortify conjutation, will power and magicka for weri short time so you basic can cast this spell constant.
Ther is detect life who is good like shoch spell 3 pts in 100 ft on target and this will show you the locations of anything within 100 ft of your target by directing a lightning bolt at it.
And For misticism i dont know whay people whant 100% reflect spell, demage or spell absorption to bee soo izzy to cast, that will brake your game expiriance weri fast.
I love to use like 5 pts of reflect spell and absorption like add on in 2 or 3 spells so it bild up nice whit some week items my stats.
Ther is soo meny nice combination of spell you only need to think.

[BFG]

Hmm, this is a good topic. I think I'd have a tough time picking which I think is least useful (which is why I haven't voted yet). With the exception of Restoration, I find one or two spells useful from each school and I'd have a hard time giving any one of them up, particularly when you can combine schools together in custom spells.

Restoration: Definitely useful. I don't think anyone would argue that one.
Destruction: I agree with the comments above that Destruction is expensive, particularly in the higher levels/difficulties. But my current weapon of choice, which uses a combo of elemental magic, Weakness to Element, and Weakness to Magicka, can defeat even the most powerful enemies in 6 or 8 hits. It would take a couple hundred hits without this enchantment to bring the same enemy down.
Mysticism: Needed for Detect Life and Soul Trap. I wouldn't be able to sufficiently power the weapon I mention above without Soul Trap so this one's a must.
Illusion: I'd hate to give up Chameleon. Otherwise I'd be okay without it.
Alteration: I can't really think of anything in this category I would consider essential. I do occasionally use elemental shield spells but that's about it. I could probably put it on the chopping block.
Conjuration: I agree with the above comments that for the most part, Conjuration spells are too short and expensive to be worthwhile. However I like having a Storm Atronach as an effective meat (stone?) shield and distraction.

For my play style, I suppose I'd be willing to give up Alteration first. But I think the "least useful" magic school pretty much depends on your playing style.

[Warlock]

I agree, I also think Mysticism is the least useful, I mean its not totally useless its just the only spell I really use is detect life and even then I use that rarely.
With a spell like reflect spell or damage it is much easier just to enchant as I have those spells but never use them, I do however like them on armor
but restoration isn't really very useful either I mean the self healing spells are useful but the other elements of it aren't like absorb and I mean you could always just use a potion

[azuarc]

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[Josjie]

Restoration: Definitely useful. I don't think anyone would argue that one.

Sorry but I never use Restoration . Every character starts with a very powerful health ability: the wait button. Wait for 1 hour and your health is fully restored.

When my health gets close to 0 during fights I've usually done something terribly wrong. I only use Restoration spells when I'm playing on 100% difficulty.

I'm not saying that Restoration is useless, I just don't really like it and imo it's the least useful magic school. My Atronach Altmer is strong enough with a blade + some Destruction spells.

[Flairinsich]

I use restoration a good chunk of the time time and im a kajiit warrior/thief and i use it pretty much.

[BFG]

Restoration: Definitely useful. I don't think anyone would argue that one.

Sorry but I never use Restoration . Every character starts with a very powerful health ability: the wait button. Wait for 1 hour and your health is fully restored.

Yeah, I should probably qualify that statement! I don't use Wait to heal for that specific reason--I just think it's too unrealistic that 1 hour of waiting time = a full restoration. (And yes, I recognize that a magic spell that does the same thing in a few seconds isn't exactly realistic either... )

[Kestral]

Alteration has to be the most useless. A max feather spell can be achieved at a fairly low level with the skill, and feather really is the only useful effect to Alteration when you're running on too much stuff. And who said you can't have too much stuff.

[Bit555]

Mysticism = total waste of time - the only skill less useful is speechcraft.

(That's actual fact by the way, not just my opininion)

[edit: took me ages to realise that alchemy is not stink as, but actually 100% awesomesauce.....you've just got to be patient]

[Bit555]

Alteration has to be the most useless.....

Yeah, you think that now - but wait until the next Tamriel heatwave when you'll be all like "Oh man, I wish I could run around in just my loincloth relying on my 100% shield spells. But noooo, I didn't learn me any alteration."

[Siken]

I dont whant to be off topic, "but" this topic is like TROLLING OBLIVION.

[Mattbott]

instead of 'most useless' read as 'least useful' and the trolls will go away

alteration is mega useful if you dont wear armour or pick locks and if you are a non Argonian looking to do some swimming
illusion helps you hide and see things also very useful but i use these effects through magic items eg finn gleam
mysticism has useful effects (soul trap, absorb spell, reflect) but i usually only use these effects via powerful magic items (reflect 5% for 30 seconds is isn't a must have spell imo) and at higher levels so mysticism is almost the mark of the powerful sorceror and 'useful' suggests every day practical applications? But them detect life sigil stones are very useful for adventuring

Destruction and Conjuration can be very effective but not 'useful', most characters own armour and weapons and these schools are less reliable and usually less effective replacements, but i don't consider dest and conj useless, nor is restoration useless since my enemies rarely let me wait to heal up during combat

alchemy has to be the most useful esp for non mages since you can duplicate all the useful 'on self' effects plus brew poison. I think alchemy is almost too useful - they could allow you the ability to brew poisons at journeyman and let you start off knowing an extra effect to balance it out a bit

I'd say mysticism is the least useful school cos aside from soul trap (which i usually only use by getting umbra anyhow) i can do without everything else from that school at any level. When i am 30th level i dont need constant 33% reflect/absorbtion (although it is nice )

i found that in Oblivion enchanting was toned way down and the sigil stones and alchemy skills made most magic schools obsolete for me - i had to work quite hard at my mage characters to get into them enough to make them work. I think magic could be more powerful in TES or maybe made more unpredictable (a chance of crits doing amazing things would be great)

[azuarc]

I can see Mysticism is starting to run away with this, and that makes me sad. Mysticism is the school that seems most useless until you actually start using it. Nobody questions that making stuff go boom, or healing yourself, or turning invisible is somehow useful on the surface. But the practical applications of some of those, along with everything in Alteration and maybe Conjuration are less than the value of being a trained Mystic.

Sorry but I never use Restoration . Every character starts with a very powerful health ability: the wait button. Wait for 1 hour and your health is fully restored.....My Atronach Altmer is ...

Well, yeah, when you're playing Atronach, it makes sense to use a mana-free alternative to healing. Otherwise, if you aren't an active mage, you'll be casting that default spell you got whenever you've got nothing more specific to do with your mana. I'm also not terribly fond of "waiting." Maybe the game won't let you wait when there's enemies nearby, but it still feels plain weird to sit and do nothing for an hour, let alone recover your full health as a result.

Mysticism = total waste of time - the only skill less useful is speechcraft.

(That's actual fact by the way, not just my opininion)

lol at statements like this. I'll assume you're being facetious, since I'm not sure how you could prove that BS argument.

Yeah, you think that now - but wait until the next Tamriel heatwave when you'll be all like "Oh man, I wish I could run around in just my loincloth relying on my 100% shield spells. But noooo, I didn't learn me any alteration."

Eh, I'll just cast Heat Shield...er, ok. No. Then I'll jump underwater and use Water Breathing...bah, never mind. Fine, I'll just cast a low-damage high-duration frost damage spell on myself!

instead of 'most useless' read as 'least useful' and the trolls will go away

Thing is, those aren't completely synonymous. "Least useful" means that the utility value is minimal. In that sense, Destruction and Conjuration do nothing you couldn't accomplish with a blade, bow, and a suit of armor. "Most useless" means it has the lowest overall value, and in that sense I could see argument being made that dealing damage via destruction spells is more useful than being able to cast a spell to open locks when you could get the Skeleton Key instead.

[Pancake]

Every type of magic has their potential, depending on the character you're playing.

Say, I'm a dedicated MAGE who thinks using a sword or axe is barbaric, then, in a first person words:
DESTRUCTION/CONJURATION : my main weapon, otherwise how do those pesky scamp could die?It's either destruction or conjration...But I'd prefer DESTRUCTIOn because of the custom spell [DRAIN FATIGUE 100pt+ DAMAGE FATIGUE 100 pt for 4s] and seeing those enemies fall down longer than paralyze could make.
RESTORATION : my support skill ,not for the healing but for the custom spell FORTIFY MAGICKA 100 pt 5s+ FORTIFY INTELLIGENCE 100 pt 5s. With this I could cast Frost Damage 100 pt for 10s on enemy.
ALTERATION : OK, I'm a full mage with dedication towards magic, therefore I have ZERO defense. Using a Shock Shield Sigil on my clothing is clever, but I'd rather put 50pts magicka or 12 pts Willpower there. Plus I need the 250 pts feather from Beast of Burden, and I'm too bored dealing with stupid LOCKS *LOL*
ILLUSION : My Valuable support skill, Making a custom spell [WEAKNESS TO MAGIC 100 % + INVICIBLE to self for 20s] is a valuable asset as enemies begin to be very dangerous past Lv 25. Although use it only when necessery.
ALCHEMY : Surprisingly not that useful for me, I'd only maximize this so I could make a strong custom regenerate magicka potion. Other than that I'd just let those barbarian use my poison potion.
MYSTICISM : Ok I admit, I don't need soul trapping souls because I don't have weapon to enchant too. I use magic , see? But I love playing one-on-one with lich using [REFLECT MAGIC 100 pt for 2s] and seeing it die from it's own spell.

Well for me that's really depend on character you're playing. If I'm a melee fighter the values are different too. DESTRUCTION is for WEAKNESS to [element] spell. MYSTICISM is for Soul Trapping. Illusion is for, well PARALYZE. ALCHEMY is the strongest point for malee fighter though. ALTERATION is not useful for Heavy armor warrior, but could shine on Light armor warrior. It's ALL RELATIVE.

Aghh I'm talking way too much. But for the vote I pick Mysticism . Anyway, I'm new member here pleased to meet all of you. Sorry for the BAD english...

[Bit555]

....Sorry for the BAD english...

**Bit555 casts 90 pts of Don't-Worry-About-It for 47 seconds in 15 ft on Pancake**

[Pancake]

....Sorry for the BAD english...

**Bit555 casts 90 pts of Don't-Worry-About-It for 47 seconds in 15 ft on Pancake**

Awww thank you

[Mattbott]

the trouble with magic in Oblivion is that everything you can do with spells can be duplicated (often much better) with sigil stones and notable magic items which by now we all know how to get. So loin cloth dude can wear rings and amulets and get 100% shield without being able to read from an alteration magic book and amazingly enough, at high level an enchanter who has spent decades poring over texts is crappier at enchanting than a nord meathead who squashes everything in a plane of oblivion and steals a transcendent sigil stone.
Magic is quite underpowered imo, so you could argue that all schools are useless compared with other stuff you find in the game. Since this is a 1 player game there is the opportunity to give magic more ooompff without damaging balance too much. After all you are the numero uno hero in the land. So why not allow magic specialists (ie characters who pursue magic at the cost of everything else) to create spells off the scale of the current system? And allow very powerful npcs also to have one hit kill spells ? The annal of the fire nexus is a scroll which is approaching the order of power i'd like my character to cast if he's devoted himself totally to destruction. The danger is exceeding the limits of the computer's brain (summon your 20 zombies and watch it crash) but maybe for the future..

but the topic of this thread isn't useless spells, it's useless schools, so we could be looking as much at thieves with invisibility rings and fighters with umbra (perhaps the most powerful possible application of the school of mysticism in the game?) as mages casting spells. Items like finn gleam (alteration and illusion) utilise the schools of magic as much as an atronarch conjurer would.

according to the wiki, there are six schools, alchemy is a skill btw

[Siken]

You say that nice.
But i say ther are mod for game to create balance to match your needs.
Like this Intelligence Overhaul mod who will change Oblivion in way that class of hero will make bigg difference.

[Mattbott]

i'm mostly on the 360 so can't do mods

[Fiar]

Mysticism, I don't think I've ever bothered to level it. Only thing I could ever need from it are detect life for a stealth character (In which case the character tends to have the Gray Cowl.), or soul trap (In which case, either a staff or the Umbra Sword are what I use).

Mysticism in my scope of play, is the most easily thrown aside school of all. It can be replaced like that by an item.

The rest of the spells in the school I never use.

[Nitron]

Soul Trap doesn't require much skill to cast, and there are several items with that enchantment. But its still a good spell. Need to keep those items charged, especially my Magicka absorbing sword. Detect Life is not very efficient. And at level 1 on one of my characters, I already had Fin Gleam and a Basic Ring of Detect Life, which gave me a total of 45 or 50 feet constant effect. If this was Morrowind, I'd probably take it as a class skill.

[azuarc]

So loin cloth dude can wear rings and amulets and get 100% shield...

OMG, you've just created my new favorite hero. All hail Loin Cloth Dude, the impervious naked man!