Creation Club

[legoless]

Pretty gross.

"Most of the Creation Club content is created internally, some with external partners who have worked on our games, and some by external Creators."

Seems like a platform for releasing never-ending, poor quality DLCs. We haven't seen the pricing yet but it looks like the cost of the "full" Skyrim experience is about to start growing exponentially. And that's not even considering the announcement of Switch-exclusive content.

Bethesda is playing it fast and loose with their stamp of official approval. Is this damaging to TES?

[Archer]

The argument can be made for both sides, I think.

On one hand, it means that we can get more official content that, depending on how thorough Bethesda is, could be on par with already released DLC.

On the other, I can see that if this store is a success, it could potentially push back the release of ES6 to the point that it's extremely possible there could be a decade plus between entries into the series.

[KingFeraligatr]

I hold the same stance as I did before when this [&@%!] last time: paid mods are [&@%!] and should burn in hell hard. It jusr creates more rifts in the community, promotes laziness and stealing, corrupts the community, and more. I am partial self modder myself and I never supported [&@%!] like this.

Of course, given Beth's greed and laziness, [&@%!] like this was always going to happen and is probably going to stay..........

[The SheoDovah]

It will end up being the Bethesda answer to Steam Greenlight. Sure, to begin with, they will test everything and make sure it works but over time, they will give up, allow everything through. Bethesda is not exactly the best developer to test things either. They can diguise it as DLC but it is literally paid mods. It will split the modding community in half.

I really hope it won't result in TES VI being delayed so that they can attempt to squeeze out more cash with Skyrim. Seriously, they are doing two more versions. VR and Switch. They are intent on milking it, it seems.

[legoless]

It will end up being the Bethesda answer to Steam Greenlight. Sure, to begin with, they will test everything and make sure it works but over time, they will give up, allow everything through. Bethesda is not exactly the best developer to test things either.

All super valid points. A free-for-all in a year's time would literally be worst case scenario, in my mind.

[Will Zurmacht]

Seems fine as an experiment. If there is a market for well-executed and reasonably priced small pieces of premium content, then the service should flourish. If quality declines over time or the free mod ecosystem is severely impacted then CC should die a deserved death on the vine.

Beth is at its best when it focuses its energies on rich, expansive base games, story DLC, and modding tools to expand those bases. Horse armor, Frostcrag Citadel(sp), Hearthfire et al would probably have been richer pieces of content if made by outsiders with the time and financial motivation to produce top content. That said, CC is obviously being designed partially as a platform to monetize various "game jam"-type creations that Beth devs think up in the years following a game's release. If nothing else, it should be interesting to see the difference in quality between internal Beth offerings, external sanctioned mods, and free mods. This business model's confrontation with free mod culture has been a long time coming (after some false starts in recent years).

[The SheoDovah]

They kinda are done by outsiders. Granted, unoffically but i think, there were mods floating around before they did Hearthfire that is a lot more complex and more varied. I really am hoping that I will be wrong about BethesdaLight but honestly, i can't help but think it will end up as Greenlight:Bethesda Edition.

The question is though, who will try to sue Jim Sterling if he covers it?

But yeah, i've got little to no hopes for it.

[Dalos]

There's an active modding community around the TES and Fallout games for several reasons:
1. Bethesda released bug infested games that needed mods (MCP, MPP, various unofficial patches) to fix problems that never should have made it, imo, through the development cycle.
2. Bethesda releases games that aren't finished and need more. Like iron sights for FO3, a decent UI (DarNified and Sky), a decent companion/follower
3. NPCs that look like the South end of a rat traveling North.
4. Bethesda released the Construction Set, Creation Kit and GECK that made it so much easier to make a mod and fix their games. They're not all you need but are a hella good start.

I'm sure there are as many reasons as there are modders.

I see nothing but downside associated with Creation Club.

Will Bethesda "curate" these mods better they do with the associated games!
Only "original" mods and nothing available now? Ya right! Any bets on the over/under? I say 30 days before a mod from Nexus shows up for sale.
Will Bethesda's modding tools, for future TES/Fallout games, remain free to all? Corporations do love making money and are loath to give away the tools that might decrease the bottom line.
It just isn't the corporate way.
And reasons.

This Creation Club BS grieves me and gives me little hope of a Bethesda revival and a return of TES to the glory that was Morrowind or Fallout to what Obsidian made it.
I know, the best of the Fallout games isn't a Bethesda game.
Go figure!

I've included Fallout because it's one of the two franchises that have made Bethesda what it is.
Would Bethesda own id Software if not for the success of TES and FO?

I could see Bethesda becoming an EA clone. Just longer between game iterations.

After the last few attempts, who would dare sue "Jim F'ing Sterling Son"?

A second thought, maybe it'll be a combination of the two.
Mods that fix the bugs Bethesda leaves in, the mods that help make their games playable, will remain free.
Other content, not so much.

[The SheoDovah]

A lot of petty developers who had their feelings hurt by Jim [&@%!] Sterling,Son because he showed their rubbish games. Digital Homcide levels of petty. Also, remember to thank god. For Jim Sterling.

[Kerr]

When it comes to paid mods I feel the best solution is pay what you want starting from $0 for everything ala Bandcamp or Humble Store. Obviously the details of where you'd host that payment model and how much Bethesda would get is complicated but I don't think many people would object to the concept.

Not gonna happen though because Zenimax wouldn't approve. I mean hell, they aren't even giving out review copies of their games anymore.

1. Bethesda released bug infested games that needed mods (MCP, MPP, various unofficial patches) to fix problems that never should have made it, imo, through the development cycle.
2. Bethesda releases games that aren't finished and need more. Like iron sights for FO3, a decent UI (DarNified and Sky), a decent companion/follower.

See this is a worry for me. Bethesda has a lot, a lot of problems in their design which often get brushed aside with "oh, you can just get a mod for that." Which is true, mods can fix a lot of the design decisions people dislike. But that doesn't make those poor design decisions okay. The best recent example I can think of is Survival Mode for Fallout 4, a new difficulty setting which added a tonne of features, a number of which I was interested in. Unfortunately Survival Mode was an all or nothing affair and either you activated all of these options (including only being able to save by sleeping in a bed, in Bethesda game, as if I trust those to be stable enough that I won't lose 40 minutes of progress because the game crashed) or none of them. I and a lot of other people wanted each of the options to be individually toggleable. But that didn't happen. Sure mods exist to fix that but I got Fallout 4 on PS4 so, no mods. And even if I could get mods, it's still not an excuse for those not being toggleable by default.

Bethesda has a history of UI which isn't optimized for keyboard and mouse, UI mods to make the interface more friendly for keyboard and mouse are really common. And Fallout 4 has a godawful Misc section where all your holotapes (audio logs & notes basically) go and it is next to impossible after a few dozen hours of play to find what you're looking for. Bethesda should have better UI, mods are no excuse. But what incentive will Bethesda ever have to make better UI if UI mods are some of the most popular mods in existence and they could now exist in Creation Club? It would actively benefit Bethesda to not have a separate UI system for Keyboard and Mouse in their vanilla game as it saves them development time and means they can make a cut of the profit from whatever big popular UI mod is sold through Creation Club.

[Mefris Elmek]

It's a platform where freelance devs,modders and third party dev studios can produce content in collaboration with Bethesda.The devs/modders get paid (finally) for their work and the consumer gets more content for their games.I don't see anything bad about it.Everything pushed through the Creation Club has to be pitched first and approved before Bethesda gives the ok to start development.Mods already out can't be put in the Creation Club.Everything has to be made from scratch.Bethesda will work with the people making the content side by side and will help with the QA testing (which doesn't amount to much when we look at the state of their games but hey,at least the content creator doesn't have to do it on his/her own).Also,everything made in the CC will work with your current save files which is a big bonus.Having to start over a playthrough because you add a few mb's of content is a major hassle (not just in Bethesda games but in all of them).

P.s The notion that mods should be free on principle is a load of mudcrab poop in my book.
P.p.s Fingers crossed for an Obsidian dlc.

[The SheoDovah]

There are far better ways of getting paid for mods. E.g. Patreons, Donate buttons etc.. All of it tends to be optional or a case of "Hey, if you love my stuff, feel free to donate/support my patreon." This? This is Bethesda's answer to greenlight.(Again, I hope to be proven wrong)

I am doubtful Obsidian or any of the major developers will want to do mods for Skyrim. It would take away their time and resources from their own projects. Obsidian was screwed over by Bethesda's publishing arm with the god awful, metacritic clause that cost them a huge bonus or royalties or both and this is not likely to give them that much incentive. That and they are a busy studio nowadays.

It would be easy for Bethesda to pretty much allow existing mods that have been slightly altered. Using Greenlight as an example, it pretty much started with the notion of allowing indie games and being checked, tested etc.. Then it devolved quickly into a free for all mess. Bethesda isn't Valve and unless they have set up a third or fourth studio to check thousands of mods, test them, i am doubtful that they will not give up.

[Mordred]

Question from someone clueless about this: Would this effect or be an answer to the "only mods that contain original assets on ps4" thing? Like would it then allow the community modders a chance to get their work onto platforms with that kibd of restriction because then its technically "official " or something?

[ToTheMadhouse]

I have to admit I was wondering this myself Mordred. Perhaps Creators will have the option to port there work for free?

[Mordred]

My only knowledge about modding is almost n9n-existant Madhouse. It boils down to using them back on Morrowind and using and playtesting a few for creator's on oblivion, then my alienware phoned home on me and I've. been stuck with only 360 for Skyrim. 8(

But the article I read a week or so ago had some things mentioned by Bethesda like small things such as pots/vases, clothing, armors etc. And I had assumed some of the assets that those ps4 restrictions and the like would probably be a way for them to control any seemingly "controversial " things.
Skimpy armors, "violent" mods etc. Any of modern non-gaming's current boogymen etc. Thats what got me thinking that if the creation club content is done by modders but vetted by Bethesda. It would then be "original/official assets" right? And then modders could get their work out there to us guys who want it all! Right? Lol
In the next cpl months im going to have a new gaming rig built but im also going to get updated consoles so I can stay in contact with friends I've made on em from all over the world. And where TES games are concerned. I'll always want to mainly play on PC, but, even if they were charging a tiny bit but allowed me to get ANY mods from the community modders, then I wouldnt have a problem with them not being free. But the emphasis for me is on the "charging a small amount".

I've been gaming longer than almost anyone I know. I'm old lol. And not fond of Alot of things the industry does now. But unless Bethesda did something really screwed up, I'll still be loyal, I just hope something happens so I can have the same mods on my Ps4 when I get it, as on my PC.

[legoless]

Question from someone clueless about this: Would this effect or be an answer to the "only mods that contain original assets on ps4" thing? Like would it then allow the community modders a chance to get their work onto platforms with that kibd of restriction because then its technically "official " or something?

I think this is definitely an answer to the PS4's restrictive modding. Bethesda want to publish the content so that Sony will allow it onto their platform.

[The SheoDovah]

Wasn't the whole PS4 not having mods beyond retextures due to Sony wanting/demanding Bethesda check every single mod?

I would assume that Sony would view it as Bethesda content and may either treat it as an in game store that functions like microtransactions but on a bigger basis or will remain hands off as long as Bethesda ensures that content doesn't break their terms.

[Dalos]

Creation Club, Bethesda's way to take advantage of Sony's obstinance over what mods Sony will allow and make money doing it.

[Dalos]

Well Cretin Club was unleashed on Fallout 4 last month and it was as bad as expected.
This month is Skyrim's turn.

I'm still working on getting FO4 back to what it was before CC launched and updated my game.
Now I have Steam set to only update when I launch and I only plan to launch in off-line mode.

Bethesda has changed.
It's no better than EA and Warner Bros now.

[Dalos]

Without so much as a by your leave, Skyrim SE was updated with the Creation Club crap.
I had updates disabled except when I launched the game and I didn't launch it.
I launched Steam.
The just implemented script extender broke and so the game wouldn't launch.
Lucky the skse64 version for the creation club's intrusion was already up.

Will it always be up & ready whenever Bethesda has more paid mods available and needs to update?
Probably not.

What's next from the avaricious folks at Bethesda, dragons dropping loot crates?