Will Zurmacht wrote:Those games encouraged replayability even after I had exhausted the content, because I was younger, less jaded, and easier to please in general back then.
Now that's just a little insulting, you can't discount comparisons with the older games just because of possible nostalgia. Hours played points to the quantity of content rather than the quality.
Hours played also gives you a good idea of the quality of it. Fallout 4 is in some ways a large game; large enough to make you wonder if there is something better waiting down the line. The gameplay itself is fun for awhile, but it's got about as much depth as Minecraft.
Also, I think Will is right about Fallout 4 not being as good as BGS' older games, none of which can beat the crown jewel of Bethesda Softworks' Morrowind (arguably) Will knows how it is...knows BGS is worsening in quality (and needs to just stop with DLC).
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GamerAim wrote:Also, I think Will is right about Fallout 4 not being as good as BGS' older games, none of which can beat the crown jewel of Bethesda Softworks' Morrowind (arguably) Will knows how it is...knows BGS is worsening in quality (and needs to just stop with DLC).
GamerAim wrote:Also, I think Will is right about Fallout 4 not being as good as BGS' older games, none of which can beat the crown jewel of Bethesda Softworks' Morrowind (arguably) Will knows how it is...knows BGS is worsening in quality (and needs to just stop with DLC).
I think that post was sarcasm lol
I know, but it's funnier if I take it seriously and have them think I think they agree with me and are proving my own points. Get it? Haha.
The Lord Vigil, High Avatar of the Order of the Mortal Gods Jesmate and the Patron Saints of Virtue. A vote for anyone is a vote for chaos. Choose the Order. Contact your nearest Order representative for more info on how you can better the world.
Nuka World meant I got blue hair dye which is A+. Hopefully the next Fallout will give us some nail polish. Charlie Bailey has just departed on a vacation to Nuka World with her girlfriend Piper. But I have 0 interest in actually leading a group of raiders which I know is meant to be a big draw of the DLC. I'm playing a Neutral Good Minutemen General/Railroad Operative not the Toecutter. So we'll see how it goes.
Although honestly I'm not sure which characters it does make sense for. The four main factions in Fallout 4 are Neutral Good, Chaotic Good, Lawful Neutral and Lawful Evil. None of which really gel with Chaotic Evil Raiders who want to go around the Commonwealth shooting people and stealing their stuff. Don't get me wrong, being able to lead a raider gang makes sense and something you should have but I'm not sure how well it goes with what's already established when it comes to roleplaying your character. Because there's no way my character would lead Raiders. If leading a group of raiders had been there from vanilla as a 5th faction there wouldn't be any conflict but we'll see. I just hope the main quest doesn't go the other extreme of not letting you be Good in any meaningful sense. But even if the main quest is super short because I just kill all the raiders, Nuka World should at least be fun to explore. I've wanted to explore a theme park in Fallout for a long time, ever since I had one in a Fallout RPG I was running but then the players never actually went inside and all my notes and time I spent planning it went to waste.
So we have come to solve every squabble in the village personally? The last thing you never see
I should preface this by saying I'm not that far in the DLC yet. I won't be doing the Raider questline (although I haven't overthrown them yet) and I've mostly been exploring the park which is pretty cool.
In the DLC you become "Overboss" for 3 gangs of raiders, so the 3 leaders of the gangs answer to you. They're like dukes to your king or the Vegas families to your Mr House. But there is a quest I picked up from one of the slaves the raiders keep called "Open Season" which is just to kill the leaders of the 3 raider gangs. So if you want to get rid of the raiders, free the slaves, etc you can do it but there doesn't seem to be much to that questline. It's like Destroy the Dark Brotherhood in Skyrim. There aren't any achievements tied to it, if those interest you then you have to go the raider route which from what I understand makes the Minutemen hate you. I've heard there is a quest in the raider questline to restore full power to the park, by default not everything is powered up. But it is a quest you can do independently of the raider quest line.
So if you don't want to side with the raiders there is a quest you can get to oust them but that does mean the main questline of Nuka World will be unavailable to you. There will however still be side quests (although naturally none from Raiders or Raider radiant quests) and the park will still be open to explore.
Like I said having you be able to be join Raiders is a cool idea but you can see why people are annoyed with it being the main questline of the DLC. It would be like if the Dark Brotherhood questline was DLC for Skyrim. You can kill the Brotherhood but it's a lot less content than joining them. In Vanilla Skyrim that's fine, there's a lot of other content, but if you paid for the Season Pass or bought Dark Brotherhood separately it would be different because unless you want to be an assassin there isn't much to do. I know it's completely off topic, but did anyone else wish there was an option to side with Astrid over the Dark Mother in Skyrim? Not everyone wants to take their orders from a spooky skeleton afterall.
So we have come to solve every squabble in the village personally? The last thing you never see
You know what...I played for a bit last night and was pretty annoyed that I couldn't kill all those raiders to begin with. I agree with your sentiments and although I'm typically slow to complain about Bethesda...this time it seems warranted. There should have been a questline independent of whether or not you join the Raiders. On one hand, it makes sense that they're tied together because it's a Raider settlement. On the other, what?! Give us a choice! Honestly, I'm rather disappointed in the DLC material for this game. I like the vanilla game, and Far Harbor was okay. But I don't give two craps about robots or vaults. Why would my character EVER want to live/build/have a settlement in a vault after what she's been through? Come on, Bethesda. My heart hurts.
Shot the dude at the entrance because he was directly responsible for the deaths of many. No explaining, buster. You'se a dead man.
At this point (just barely finished the gauntlet before saving my game for the night), Chloe is marinating on some plans. There are too many Raiders at Nuka World for her and MacCready to take on. So for now, she's playing along with their stupid game, scoping out the layout of the land, and plans on returning with an army of Minutemen and BOS to take down the Raiders.
The one thing she hasn't quite figured out yet is why the Gunners were there to begin with.
What the heck Bethesda!? I wanted to be very positive about Nuka World and it has a fun concept but forcing the player to follow the raiders? Not cool. The closet to a raider oriented DLC prior to this was The Pitt and they did it well. It wasn't ideal but it was glorified Raiders and it worked. Making Nuka World's main quest entirely Raider focused? I hope it was a case of them running out of time thus leaving out an altnerative version where non-raiders have their own questline. If not, this is very shocking due to how excellent Bethesda tends to be with TES DLC.
They got carried away with crafting in Fallout 4. Nothing wrong with that. I love crafting but from an outside view, it shouldn't be the main focus. But oh well. Didn't they say there would be a lot of story DLC? If so, oh man, that is a let down. I know I would enjoy Fallout 4 when I get it in the future and probably on PC. PS4 is the most likely version but Bethesda RPGs, i'm considering making PC only due to the sheer amount of mods they tend to have.
It does make me wonder if crafting was experimental thus the high amount of focus they put on it and using what they did for TESVI. Developers often do it in DLC and Fallout is their secondary franchise.
RANDOM SILLY STATEMENT AS SIGNATURE! Praise Sheogorath!
You are definitely not forced to follow the raiders. The game treats eradicating the raiders as your second path. It's exactly like destroying DB in Skyrim. You have the option to, but you're basically saying "I don't want to have this dessert". As for there not being a quest line without the raiders, the quest line would have simply been building more settlements for the Minuteman (albeit, I'm surprised the legitimately didn't do this. In fact, there is NO settlement building in Nuka World). I don't exactly understand why we didn't get any kind of settlement building for this one, I feel like it would have been pretty easy to support. I like the idea of my settlers basically controlling half a dozen forts.
So my only real complaint is the sheer futility of the Minuteman faction never being resolved. You never advance beyond the initial quests with them, so if you had, this Raider path could have been a lot more fun, especially for evil characters which are now a lot more viable. And considering the response Preston has to you conquering settlements (instant, unique disapproval speech, with him immediately ending companionship), it seems like the developers literally based this entire DLC off of the memes based around Preston being annoying.
Preston asking you to run too many radiant quests? Well now he won't talk to you ever again! Minuteman seem useless? Well now they'll actually do something, ATTACK YOU. Settlers not giving you any benefits? Well now you can rob them blind! It's almost a magnum opus of them mocking their own settlement development system, with how little benefit their is to the effort it requires.
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@Dov: crafting isn't the focus of Fallout 4. It's a big part of it if you so choose that route, but there's still plenty to do without taking on settlements.
AKB: I feel ya. There's no way in hell my character would ever side with Raiders. The fact that we can't build settlements at Nuka World really disappoints me and I agree that it almost seems like a mockery. They gave us the useless Vault dlc. What 13 yr old suggested that one?! Sigh. Bethy really fell on their heads this time. There was so much potential DLC wise in this game. I'm still exploring Far Harbor so there's plenty for me to do. I'm just annoyed that they switched the script from Minutement to Raiders.
Btw...I think you can kill off the Brotherhood with the Minutemen. I've read about it but haven't done it in my game. It's not like they give me any quests or whatever...but taking down that entire blimp of people + a cat just seems stupid. But I think that's the follow through with the Minutemen. I'll still play (also got Survival to finish) but DLCs...groan.
You CAN take down the Brotherhood with Minuteman artillery (a blimp still can't take any heavy blast, obviously). But the interesting choice with going with the Minuteman is the relative peace you can achieve between most of the factions.
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That's why we tell you not to believe everything you read. Playing the game is really the only way to understand. I mean...yes...in a way, the early Minutemen quests are dependent on settlements. But you can just ignore them afterwards, and the worst thing that'll happen is them leaving your alliance. And that doesn't really affect much from what I've seen when my husband has played (he's let his settlements fade because it's not his favorite part of the game and still had plenty to do).
You can basically stop doing Minutemen quests once you unlock The Castle unless you're going their path in the Main Quest. If you run a settlement and set up enough turrets they can often just defend themselves. I don't like Bethesda radiant quests and spent more time than I would have liked on my first playthrough doing them. I was happier once I stopped bothering with them.
Even though the main quest was lacking for me (I did as far as I was expected to actually raid anyone before killing the raiders) Nuka World itself was enjoyable to explore and there were some fun side quests. Would have been cool if Cito or Oswald were companions.
Now for some spoilery comments!
Spoiler:
How on earth does Gage know I'm a Railroad Operative?
I didn't like XO-1 being retconed into a Pre-War prototype just because Bethesda wanted to give you powerful armor for getting all the Star Cores. Like come on, even Fallout 4's loading screens acknowledge it was created by the Enclave.
Ghosts! The Winchester Grandchester Mansion is a nice location and the ghost isn't more significant than say the Dunwich building spookiness or the ghost in Fallout 2. But I don't want supernatural stuff like that in Fallout and do hope it never comes to the forefront in a future game. Psionics are fine though, they are a thing which have existed since Fallout 1. They were in Fallout 4, Mama Murphy and Cabot. And psionics definitely fit with the 1950s sci-fi aesthetic.
Last edited by Kerr on Sun Sep 04, 2016 11:41 pm, edited 4 times in total.
So we have come to solve every squabble in the village personally? The last thing you never see
Woof. I'm having quite the difficult Survival run atm. No particularly great legendary weapons or armour means I'm getting knocked around pretty bad, and--goddamnit Piper, stop walking in front of me when I'm throwing molotovs!
I got killed by explosions more often than any other kind of attack in Fallout 4. Raiders put away your pipe guns and pick up molotovs, they're much better.
I really wish the survival options were individually toggleable, I would have liked if everyone (me and NPCs) did double damage. Bethesda creatures always turn into damage sponges at higher levels, it doesn't make combat more interesting, just tedious. Broken Steel was really bad for this, Oblivion was probably the worst.
So we have come to solve every squabble in the village personally? The last thing you never see
Agreed. Survival is seriously the hardest mode of any game ever...and I grew up playing og Mario Bros.
Because it's so difficult, I've resorted to playing a handful of moments out of time due to frustration. It's more a winter project at this point and besides, I die in my other game every now and then.
Disappointing as it would have been interesting to see if console mods could take off and if it would either catch up with PC mods(which, i would say is next to impossible at this moment in time and probably be the next generation that could have a decent chance of being on the same level PC mods) or if it would become it's own thing. Shame but limitations placed on the file size is going to harm them and well, i think PC is the best plaform for modding due to no restrictions with Bethesda's games in terms of modding.
RANDOM SILLY STATEMENT AS SIGNATURE! Praise Sheogorath!
[&@%!] you. Like, seriously. Whoever designed this DLC needs to be F.I.R.E.D. Okay, so...force me to help a group of raiders who want to take over the Commonwealth, even though it's my HOME and I've spent hundreds of hours getting it liveable.
-Can't finish some of the quests because the power isn't on.
-Go to the power plant but there' NO [&@%!] KEY.
-Find out I have to betray the gang leaders in order to get the key but there's a thousand to two and there's no way in hell that Chloe is that foolish.
-Hunting them down means finishing most of the mq but I can't do that welp, because THERE IS NO POWER.
W. T. F. This is seriously ridiculous. It's a game for crying out loud! Why does it have to be so difficult?!?!?!! DAMN YOU, BETHESDA. I HATE YOU.
EDIT: A psycho and jet enraged Chloe took Preston Garvey along for a raider bloodbath. They went to every trader on the Commonwealth, including the BOS & Tinker Tom, even in the settlements, and loaded up on all the ammo/grenades/stimpacks/chems they could buy. And she's filthy rich, mind you. About halfway through their wipeout, a lovely message sounded on the raider radio about her getting [&@%!] done. LOL. Yeah, she does. She does. Bye, bye raiders! I bet you didn't think this would happen now, did ya? :p
My name is Simon Calman. Yesterday, well, what seemed like yesterday for me, my life was perfect. I wouldn't have used that word yesterday, but today, I realise that that's what it was, perfect. My home, my family...my beautiful wife, Nora; my precious baby boy, Shaun. They're all I had in life, but they're all that I needed. And now...oh God, I can't write it down. Yesterday was such a warm, sunny Fall day, we...we were going to go to the park, me and Nora...Shaun. And then it all happened so fast. One minute I was filling in a random form to join the local Vault-Tec shelter; it was just an insurance, security should the [&@%!] hit the fan. Man, did that [&@%!] hit the fan sooner than I would have dreamed, would have ever thought possible. It was minutes, minutes later, all of us, the whole street were running, just running in sheer fear, sheer terror towards the shelter. The sounds of explosions, alarms, screams...you could feel the panic in the air. All I could think of was to just run and make sure my family was with me.
We made it. We made it in just seconds after some nuke hit not far off. I thought it was gonna get us; I held Nora and my son so tight. But we made it. I felt like we were so lucky. I didn't know, though. None of us did. The whole thing was happening so fast; we just wanted to be safe. My mind flickered for a moment at the sight of the 'decomtamination chamber' as they called it, but I trusted them. The [&@%!]. What kind of people do that? We all trusted them and now everyone is dead.
When the ice began to form on the glass inside the chamber, I knew something wasn't right. It should have been a spray or a gas or something. I could see Nora in the chamber across from me, holding Shaun so tight in her arms. She looked so scared...she looked so...
It should have been me. I should have been the one holding him. Then I would have pummelled the [&@%!] that came to take him. Why? Why did they take him? Why did they... They didn't have to kill her, she was no threat, for god sake she was barely awake, they could have just left but they just didn't give a [&@%!] damn, they just pulled the trigger and left. But I saw your face, that's right, I saw you, you ugly [&@%!] coward and I will hunt you down and kill you. I will save my son and kill you for what you've done. I will kill you if it's the last thing I do.
I learnt of the 'social experiments'. I...I feel sick. It's just disgusting. I just don't know how they could do this. Scientists really are pricks.
But anyway, I'm out now. I'm out of the vault. Holy [&@%!], the place looks like [&@%!]. I can barely recognise it. I keep thinking I'm in a nightmare and hoping I'll wake up soon. I'm walking round feeling spaced out, it's all so surreal. I picked up a gun and some stuff. There are giant [&@%!] cockroaches jumping at me; I'm scared out of my mind what else might be out here.
I hate to look at the skeletons. They could be my neighbors, my friends. I don't want to think about it. I'm trying to blank them off as Halloween decorations.
The electricity pylons are still up... or back up, at least, so that's a good sign? And there are radio stations. Guy sounds like he's smoked something, but I can't blame him. Need something to calm myself right now too. At least I know that someone is out there.
Went back to the house. It's just...I can't believe all this. One day had changed so much. I keep forgetting it's not one day. I met Codsworth outside the house. Damn thing is still working! He's still got his wits; I know he's just a robot but it felt so good to hear him. My mind still can't grasp that it's been over 200 hundred years. Maybe he's wrong; maybe his circuits are messed up.
I can't help but think...what if when Shaun was taken...I think I got frozen again after that. He could be an old man now...he could be...not here anymore. I don't know if that happened two hours ago or 100 years ago. I just don't know. I don't know anything. All I know is that my gorgeous Nora is dead and that my son is missing. All I can do now is try and survive out here and hope to find some trail to those scumbags that took my son.
I don't know what I'm gonna eat; I found a couple things on route here but they're probably not even edible. Can I even drink the water? I got this Pip-Boy thing that shows me how many rads are about. Man, I hope it's working right. I really don't want to be drinking irradiated water.
Gotta keep my [&@%!] together. Gonna take a breath and search the street with Codsworth. Got the radio on; it calms me down. Hope it doesn't make me more of a target for those roaches.
Extra: Anyone who plays Fallout 4, do you recommend any mods to install from the get-go?
I haven't played Fallout 4 on PC, so no mods I can recommend from experience. But I think a UI mod to improve the Pip-Boy would help a lot. You won't notice too much in the first few hours, but at 30+ hours the Misc section of your Pip-Boy will be your biggest enemy, finding notes in there will be impossible or at least take ages.
So we have come to solve every squabble in the village personally? The last thing you never see
Seems installing any mod disables achievements. That's crap.
Is it safe to store things in any 'container' in this game, or do they respawn? The internet is iffy for answers.
I put a load of stuff in the toolbox next to the crafting workstation in Sanctuary but am unsure if it's safe there.
Will knows how it is...knows BGS is worsening in quality (and needs to just stop with DLC).
The closet to a raider oriented DLC prior to this was The Pitt and they did it well. It wasn't ideal but it was glorified Raiders and it worked. Making Nuka World's main quest entirely Raider focused? I hope it was a case of them running out of time thus leaving out an altnerative version where non-raiders have their own questline. If not, this is very shocking due to how excellent Bethesda tends to be with TES DLC. 
Playing the game is really the only way to understand. I mean...yes...in a way, the early Minutemen quests are dependent on settlements. But you can just ignore them afterwards, and the worst thing that'll happen is them leaving your alliance. And that doesn't really affect much from what I've seen when my husband has played (he's let his settlements fade because it's not his favorite part of the game and still had plenty to do).
