Writing Dialogue (Discussion)

[Unionhack]

Hey guys, I recently went and made a video because I like talking about things, and the thing I talked about here is writing dialogue. I like writing a bunch, so it made sense and I figured someone might get something out of it. I hope this can be the font of some discussion; if not, just enjoy the soothing sound of my voice.

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YouTube Link

So, let's talk about dialogue and how to write it. How have you improved since you began writing? How else can you improve?

[Baloth-Kul]

Talk about dialogue? You mean, have a dialogue about dialogue?

You've basically hit every point I can think of. Character dialogue should sound like it's coming out of a human, not a character. Shouldn't be all Bioware. "What can you tell me about the Reapers? ...What can you tell me about the Citadel? ...What can you tell me about Uranus? ...Goodbye." They should have a consistency in tone and speech pattern, yes. They shouldn't really veer, post by post, from a posh, aristocrat, to a bashful, crude everyman. There can be a little variance--maybe a noble has a naughty side they let slip every now and then, to the shock of others. But it shouldn't be switching back and forth repeatedly. Gives me whiplash. Ech.

I have improved vastly since I started RPing here. Let's not even talk about the old days. >> Suffice it to say that I have been guilty of just about everything you mentioned. Reading back on that [&@%!], I was like "oh, that's gross, I should stop that". "Oh, that's not realistic, maybe I should phrase stuff differently". Self critiquing, self analyzing, is valuable for improving one's writing.

[BetaB17]

First off... dat voice

2nd, I actually enjoyed listening to that banter. I mean, hell, I wouldn't mind a mini-series if that was in the works

I myself still wonder just how much, or little I have imrpoved in RPs over the years. I know my sheets have 'improved'(i.e the bio is now 75% of the sheet lol), and I have been delving more for variety over comfort. But it doesn't really tell how much I've grown in RP posting improvements and character development.

I guess I'll find out just how much I've changed when I revisit an old duo of mine, and arguably my best performance. I only hope I can still pull off that same charm and mindset, instead of falling flat on my face

[Alarra]

You raised some really good points there.

I think the only one I sort of disagree with is using "laughed"; certainly it shouldn't be used all the time, but in my opinion it implies that they're kind of laughing as they're talking; like they're laughing in between words, or they're laughing while saying words (like, one situation where I could picture that is if someone's being tickled and giggling while going "No-o-o!", like, it's possible to laugh while saying the word.)

Saying too many things at once is definitely something I've noticed myself doing. I think I've gotten a bit better at that.

As far as my two characters:
- Niralie's dialogue is a bit closer to how I talk (though not exactly; it's more how I write, is probably the best way to explain it); I don't really have to think for her, I just go with the flow.
- Khazi is definitely more of a challenge: she's more uneducated, so she doesn't use a lot of more complicated words (though she did have an ex-Mages Guild mentor, so she might've picked up some here and there, but I still imagine she wouldn't use them much). She also doesn't like to talk much, so I definitely try to cut the dialogue short with her. And, of course, the Khajiit way of speaking is interesting to write, though I do have to make sure it doesn't sound too repetitive (using "this one"/"that one" too many times in a sentence, etc).

[KingFeraligatr]

The video made me realize even more how much my own writing is [&@%!]. Quite a few of my characters talk the way I would, more or less. Zudeel included (which is why he's bland sounding). I only created one character that I knew had a defined speech pattern (he was very formal to people who outranked him or he did not know. However, he was slightly less formal around friends). Sure, I'll be reusing him once I revive that RP. But even he's not that great in terms of writing and in general my writing is ass.

In terms of Zudeel: I know he's a stoic, neutral, distant, and rather worldly mercenary; but why he talks the way he does is beyond me barring the fact that I made him slightly based off myself.

To think I have a huge RP planned. Argh..... Dam [&@%!] writing. It seems I can only do lore. I don't know how my stories, plotting, characters, etc. are, but I'm sure they're [&@%!].

[Unionhack]

Easy, KF, I wouldn't go that far. This video is by no means an authoritative absolute guide on writing; iy's just what I think, and it's absolutely not a tool to tear someone down. I want it to be used as a helpful thing.

If you feel your writing is lacking, identify the problems first and then work at solving them. Writing is hard but it's easy to improve at.

@Alarra: You know, that's a good point and one I didn't really consider. I still prefer conveying that sort of like "they said with a chuckle" but again, that's only personal preference

[KingFeraligatr]

@Union My first response upon hearing almost any remotely reasonable critique (or attack), even if indirect; on something I like, feel I am, something I made, reminds me of myself, etc. is to hate myself for it. I'd be a far worse person if I didn't loathe my guts. Wouldn't be nearly as right. I am morally obligated to to be right, and since I suck (putting it really nicely) inherently, if I cannot change my ways, I can beat myself for being wrong. Being really hard on myself is a typical response. What you said only got a mild reaction out me. I can tell you, I can get far worse.

[Unionhack]

That sounds like stuff you need to work out with some professional aid. It's not healthy.

Your writing however doesn't have to suffer for that. Don't let you defeat yourself. Believe me, if we thought your writing sucked, you'd hear about it. In very veiled, constructive criticism forms of course. No one is attacking you here, indirect or otherwise. Most if not all of us on this sub are guilty of every single one of the points I mentioned, myself included.

That's the cool thing of being a writer for nearly 15 years. I have precedence on what I think is bad and good when it comes to my own style of work. I know what my mistakes were/are and with work I can try fixing them.

[Kerr]

Always remember, you don't need to be great at a hobby to enjoy doing it. Like there are plenty of people who play guitar that aren't the best guitarists of all time and that's fine, they like what they do and they're allowed be happy with what they do. The same is true of writing. Don't beat yourself up about not being the best writer ever, you don't need to be and you'll get better anyway. Write for yourself because it's something you like doing.

While I think a certain level of consistency with a character is important, you don't want them to act like a completely different person every post, it shouldn't be to the extent where a single trait about a character over time becomes exaggerated and basically that one trait becomes the entire character. (Although you could have a character really strongly focused on one trait and have it be done really well.) Or that a character can't change as a person either over time or because of a specific event. And you know, people can be hypocritical.

But yeah, I take to writing notes about NPCs and PCs I play. Honestly it's something I feel I should do more of, some times I really fall down in that aspect and the character lacks any real character. So I should take more note of that stuff, for important NPCs and my PCs. Even if it's as simple as "What D&D Alignment and Hogwarts House are they?"

Something that's always a challenge for me as a GM is if I have an NPC give the PCs a quest and then go "Any Questions?" only to have 6 players ask an average of 2 questions each and somehow try to respond to that. Like there's no way to respond to all those questions that makes any sense.

[Rook]

Something that's always a challenge for me as a GM is if I have an NPC give the PCs a quest and then go "Any Questions?" only to have 6 players ask an average of 2 questions each and somehow try to respond to that. Like there's no way to respond to all those questions that makes any sense.

I interpret situations like that playing out like a normal conversation. John asks his two questions and Jack replies. Then, in a separate line, Mary asks her two questions after Jack has answered John.

[Unionhack]

I always find a bit of anachronism is in order for that situation, Kerr. Write it in a way that's like "when X asked his question, Y said this, and when Z asked THEIR question, Y said that." Just like Rook says up above!

If you guys are down for me recording more of these I'd be happy to oblige. I don't know what topic I could do; the best idea I've got it 'characterization' but that's pretty vague. I like what this has started so far and I wanna see more. c:

[VirtualWeasel]

I honestly have stopped thinking when I write dialogue anymore, I just write whatever the character says in my head. definitely not completely ill
Of course, I go back and tweak things, but ever since I've stopped thinking about it and just let it happen like it wants to, it's been a lot better.

EDIT: "Please don't use 'chuckled' in your dialogue..."
Oh god I'm laughing too hard