Cyrodilic/Imperial supremacism

[SeventhWarlock]

Hi everyone.

Been playing the Elder scrolls games since Oblivion. I'm currently mostly into ESO. Although I'm not a big fan of some of the decisions (the cheesy plot, the three alliances, Cyrodiil being a forest and all that), I enjoy being able to experience more than one region of Tamriel. I roleplay an imperial sorceress/shadow mage and self-proclaimed "Scholar of Imperial history" who is, to put it simple, a narcissistic bigot, and believes the Imperials to be the chosen people of Akatosh. These are some of her beliefs:

- Imperials are the chosen people of Akatosh through Saint Alessia, with the mission to liberate Tamriel from the Mer oppression.

- Imperials are one indivisible nation united through the brilliance of the Nibenean mind and the might of the Colovian sword.

- Outside of Cyrodiil, the Imperial race is being subjected to a genocide by the lesser races, who want to hide the hide the fact that Cyrodilic civilisation is the driving force behind all of Man's accomplishments.

- Valenwood is a natural extension of Cyrodiil. The Alessian mandate to drive out the Mer applies to Valenwood as well. The heathen savages of the Bosmer have driven out the province's natural Imperial population, who bought civilisation to the area in the Second Era, paved roads and cultivated the land.

- Likewise, Black Marsh is a historical land of Men. Even if they tell you otherwise, Argonians are a lesser race from the dragon lands, brought to Tamriel as serfs by the Akaviri. Through savage witchcraft and knowledge of poison, the filthy Argonians have committed a genocide against the native Man tribes of the region. The Kothringi were [&@%!] offspring of Imperial with Dunmer heritage, which made their skin look grayish in comparison to pureblood Imperials.

- Bretons, and by extension Reachmen, are Imperials whose ancestors were subject to rape and indoctrination by the filthy Mer slavers. A [&@%!] son does not inherit his fathers house if there are legitimate offspring left. These people must be reintegrated into Cyrodilic civilisation.

- Nords were bought civilisation through Imperials. Falkreath, Riften and Solitude are all Imperial cities populated by the descendants of Imperials and Cyrodiliced Nords who have forgot their heritage and now believe themselves to be something else.

- Imperials across Tamriel must work to establish a Third Empire founded upon the Alessian doctrines, consisting of all historical Imperial land, including places in which the Imperial race are in the minority due to the genocide conducted against them by the lesser races.

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Now, I do love the lore behind the Elder Scrolls and have played all of the last three real Elder scrolls games, but I don't claim to be as knowledgable as some people here are. Is it plausible that an Imperial supremacist would have beliefs in line with these? I know a lot of the claims are "questionable" to say the least, but would it make sense that a bifgoted Imperial could have these beliefs, from a lore perspective?

Thank you for your attention.

[CBR JGWRR]

Without checking anything but my memory - which I'll proviso by saying I still haven't updated it with the ESO stuff - it revises some things in a way contrary to what is known, however the revisions are not out of the question in character - it is quite well done on that front, it comes across as something someone in universe may choose to believe when compared to racial supremacist views in our world.

[Dark Spark]

Such a person would regard the Nords as the savage relics of a failed past. The Cyrodiili endured the trial of blood and arose perfected above their cousins to the north who have never been tested quite that way.

Conversely, a Nord may regard the Imperials as failures because of their enslavement. Tainted and twisted by elven mastery, the Imperials win by bargaining with powers from beyond. Why, your claim of superiority via the Covenant with Akatosh says something else: Imperials lacked the strength to stand on their own and needed someone else's help, which they exploited greedily.

[legoless]

Most of the views are pretty sound, but I have to object to this part:

- Likewise, Black Marsh is a historical land of Men. Even if they tell you otherwise, Argonians are a lesser race from the dragon lands, brought to Tamriel as serfs by the Akaviri. Through savage witchcraft and knowledge of poison, the filthy Argonians have committed a genocide against the native Man tribes of the region. The Kothringi were [&@%!] offspring of Imperial with Dunmer heritage, which made their skin look grayish in comparison to pureblood Imperials.

Kothringi have translucent skin, so the Dunmeri interbreeding doesn't make much sense. They were also a minority in Argonia (as the province name would imply), so claiming that the minor footholds that the Second Empire established in Black Marsh make it a "land of Men" is a little unreasonable. Akaviri Saxhleel is also pure fantasy; our current knowledge suggests that the lizard folk were tree lizards uplifted by the (potentially Daedric) Hist.

Also, I'd steer clear of the Alessian doctrines. Even the most nationalistic Nibenean legal scholar will tell you that the Order was one of the worst things to happen to Cyrodiil, ever. You don't need to espouse belief in the One or attempt to expunge Auriel from existence in order to be anti-elf. Just ask Whitestrake.

[Pilaf The Defiler]

Right. The Nibenese of the Second Era are NOT carrying on in the vein of the Alessians*. They're considered a relic of the past and a national embarrassment. The things the Nibenese are proud of are their cosmopolitan and learned nature and their mercantile spirit, allowing them to amass vast quantities of wealth. As for the Imperial view on Nords, they're seen as dull savages, but useful soldiers when they can be made to see the light or strong-armed into joining.


*And by "The Alessians", I notably mean the crusade that culminated in that humiliating loss at Glenumbra Moors. Technically, the majority of the Nibenese Empire's history saw it under Alessian control, but not all of those monarchs were as universally detested as Gorieus. Obviously, Saint Alessia and her son Belharza are still very highly regarded by all Imperials, Colovian and Nibenese alike, and some of the latter-day Alessians like Hestra (who secured the Reach and added Bretons to the Empire for the first time) and the as of yet un-named Emperor who allied with Bendu Olo to crush the Sload are still viewed favorably by Imperial historians. And of course all of the Reman Dynasty, who both the Interregnum Imperials and the Daggerfall Covenant idolize as the ideal Golden Age rulers of Tamriel.

[SeventhWarlock]

Thanks for the feedback! So, I take it there's little love for the Alessian Order among Cyrodilic patriots. I guess such a character can still be fiercely religious, claiming that the Order was a corruption of Alessias original teachings or something like that.

Didn't know about that backstory of the Argonians and the Hist. Interesting. Since the border between Cyrodiil and Black marsh/Argonia runs on the wildlands, I guess one might still claim that parts of it should be for the Imperial "superior race" - alternatively, that merely the fact that the province used to have a native human population means that parts of it rightfully belongs to the human civilization - which the Imperials are the "driving force" behind.

I also wonder how someone with anti-Mer opinions might view the Dunmer under the Tribunal? After all, they broke away from the enslavers of the human race, and stopped worshipping the Daedra thanks to the Tribunal.

[The SheoDovah]

Nothing can take on The Black Marsh without suffering extreme losses. The forces of Mehrunes Dagon ended up running away during the Oblivion Crisis due to the Hist making every Argonian zerg rush the Daedra and the Black Marsh was the only province where they drove them back. It used to be part of the empire either out of respect for Tiber Septim or just because the Hist said so but they broke away during the early days of the 4th Era. The imperials aren't really slavers and whilst Talos(tiber septim) conquered Tamriel, he did end up strengthening the walls between Mundus and Nirn due to the Amulet of Kings and his Dragon Blood.

[Pilaf The Defiler]

I also wonder how someone with anti-Mer opinions might view the Dunmer under the Tribunal? After all, they broke away from the enslavers of the human race, and stopped worshipping the Daedra thanks to the Tribunal.

The Reman Dynasty waged a multi-decades war against Morrowind that ultimately proved futile. The Remanite Imperials of the Second Empire weren't really anti-Elf or xenophobic, at least compared to the Alessians. It's just that that dynasty wanted to accomplish what nobody until Tiber actually ended up accomplishing - to rule all of Tamriel. Like I said, the Four Score War was a bloody disaster that eventually ended in a truce around the time of Reman III's death. The Tribunal were still at full power here, with access to all their divine powers, so an Imperial victory was unlikely from the beginning.

As for how the Imperials would think of them compared to other Mer, the opinion on religious matters isn't as cut and dry as it might seem, mostly because the Dunmer have a kind of "mannish" view on Lorkhan and Nirn, by Elf standards, in that they think Lorkhan is pretty cool and Nirn was a good idea, which is something the Aldmeri Dominion definitely do not believe, being fervent adherents to fundamentalist Aldmeri ancestor worship, which can be read about in the Monomyth.

True, the idea of having three living gods who are more like Daedra than anything would be upsetting and alien for most Cyrodiils, but Dunmeri culture is seen as less "effeminate" and "haughty" than Altmer culture by the Imperials as well. Years later, under the Third Empire, the Legions and House Redoran hold a begrudging respect for one another due to their similar warrior cultures.

[legoless]

If your character is religious, they should probably strongly dislike the Tribunal. The Imperial Cult views the Temple faithful as pagan devil worshippers. In ESO we even hear about the Chantry of Akatosh sending missionaries into Morrowind, who are then killed by the Dunmer for preaching against the Tribunal. At least the Banana Queen worships the Divines.

The Imperials definitely have aspirations about expanding into Black Marsh, as can be seen by their multiple failed attempts. The fact remains, however, that it is impossible to even traverse the province, never mind occupy it. Trying to reach some of the innermost settlements will kill everyone but an Argonian. Even in their heyday, the legion forts there resembled prisons more than outposts. The closest it came to human colonisation were the coastal towns like Lilmoth in the Third Era, but they were horrible decrepit villas and were eventually taken over by the Hist after the Empire left. Kothringi might technically be men, but even before their extinction they were mostly an isolated and primitive civilisation with no innate loyalty or connection to the Ruby Throne or the rest of Tamriel. You have to remember that the Black Marsh is a fragment of Creation altogether distinct from the rest of the continent.