Is there any GOOD god/characters at all.?
- Maxrebo
- Journeyman

- Posts: 285
- Joined: Thu Jun 11, 2009 8:04 pm
- ES Games: Arena-Beaten,Daggerfall-Beaten,Battlespire-beaten,Redguard-Still haven't Beaten,Morrowind GOTY-beaten,OblivionGOTY-beaten,Skyrim and its DLC Xbox360-Beaten,ESO-Beaten except DLC(PS4)
- Platform: PC,PS4,Xbox One
- Location: Rhode Island
Re: Is there any GOOD god/characters at all.?
I almost forgot about the Vigilants of Stendarr albeit they make sense in the context of their founding.One is very unlikely to give Daedra Cults,Vampires, and other" Unholy" types the benefit of the doubt after a Daedra Cult just gave to the entire world a through beating.What's more troubling is the fact they probably masacre Daedra Cults that for the most part harmless for example Azura,Meridia,Nocturnal (as far as we know),Sanguine ( Drunken Orgies are nothing compared to the Worshipers of Dagon,Molag Bal,Namira,Peryite,Mephala have done or do.)We also not all vampires or werewolves are evil for example on all accounts,Count Hassildor is a very good ruler who happens to be a vampire but doesn't view his subjects as mere food in fact fiercely protective of them and Sinding is at least remorseful about his actions.
So for Strictly Good Gods and Characters IMHO would include the following
Ria Silmane
Cyrodillic Akatosh
Arkay
Dibella
Kyne and Kynareth
Julianos
Mara
Morihaus
Stendarr
Zenithar
St Jiub (He got rid of the cliff racers which makes up for whatever bad stuff he might have done in his life)
St Rilms
St Seryn
St Meris
Martin Septim
Chancellor Ocato
Uriel Septim the VII
Katariah Septim
Gortwog (His Goals were just)
Jurgen Windcaller
Parthunax
Barenziah (for the most part)
Ilmeni Dren
Jobasha
Divayth Fyr
The Oblivion Blades
Balgruff the Greater
St Alessia
Reman Cyrodiil
Others I can't think off the top of my head
Neutral Depends on Opinion and actions
Azura
Talos
Most of the Septims
Titus Mede the 2nd
General Tulius
Legate Rikke
Dagoth Ur
The Tribunal
Esbern and Delphine
The Greybeards (True Neutral)
Nerevar
Lorkhan and all his aspects
Boethiah
Clavicus Vile
Hermaeus Mora
Hircine
Jyggalag
Malacath
Meridia
Nocturnal
Sheogorath
Ulfric Stormcloak
Pretty much everyone in Daggerfall
The Underking
Sanguine
The Dwemer
The Hist
Pelinal Whitestrake
Thieves Guild
Morag Tong
More than I can think of
Evil
Jagar Tharn
Mannimarco
Almalexia (Crazy Version)
Mehrunes Dagon
Mephala
Molag Bal
Namira
Peryite
Vaermina
Ngasta
Umaril
Slaving Aylieds
Orvas Dren
Archmaster Venim
Alduin
Harkon
Miraak
The Dragon Cult
Potema
The 3rd Aldmeri Dominion
Sithis
Maven Black Briar
The Camoran Usurper
The Mythic Dawn
Mankar Camoran
Alessian Order
The Camonna Tong
Dark Brotherhood
and More
So for Strictly Good Gods and Characters IMHO would include the following
Ria Silmane
Cyrodillic Akatosh
Arkay
Dibella
Kyne and Kynareth
Julianos
Mara
Morihaus
Stendarr
Zenithar
St Jiub (He got rid of the cliff racers which makes up for whatever bad stuff he might have done in his life)
St Rilms
St Seryn
St Meris
Martin Septim
Chancellor Ocato
Uriel Septim the VII
Katariah Septim
Gortwog (His Goals were just)
Jurgen Windcaller
Parthunax
Barenziah (for the most part)
Ilmeni Dren
Jobasha
Divayth Fyr
The Oblivion Blades
Balgruff the Greater
St Alessia
Reman Cyrodiil
Others I can't think off the top of my head
Neutral Depends on Opinion and actions
Azura
Talos
Most of the Septims
Titus Mede the 2nd
General Tulius
Legate Rikke
Dagoth Ur
The Tribunal
Esbern and Delphine
The Greybeards (True Neutral)
Nerevar
Lorkhan and all his aspects
Boethiah
Clavicus Vile
Hermaeus Mora
Hircine
Jyggalag
Malacath
Meridia
Nocturnal
Sheogorath
Ulfric Stormcloak
Pretty much everyone in Daggerfall
The Underking
Sanguine
The Dwemer
The Hist
Pelinal Whitestrake
Thieves Guild
Morag Tong
More than I can think of
Evil
Jagar Tharn
Mannimarco
Almalexia (Crazy Version)
Mehrunes Dagon
Mephala
Molag Bal
Namira
Peryite
Vaermina
Ngasta
Umaril
Slaving Aylieds
Orvas Dren
Archmaster Venim
Alduin
Harkon
Miraak
The Dragon Cult
Potema
The 3rd Aldmeri Dominion
Sithis
Maven Black Briar
The Camoran Usurper
The Mythic Dawn
Mankar Camoran
Alessian Order
The Camonna Tong
Dark Brotherhood
and More
Re: Is there any GOOD god/characters at all.?
@Maxrebo: that's a pretty good list, and you have quite the memory. I should perhaps point out that the Vigilants of Stendarr may have reason to be reason to be indiscriminating against vampires and werewolves.
For vampires, it's true that they aren't all evil; though that can be a rare sight. It's not right to punish an innocent, though in the Vigilance's defense, it can be hard to distinguish liars.
For werewolves, many of them, even if not evil, have no exercise over their beastiel forms. Sinding is actually a perfect example; while he is a good man, he's a threat to everyone because he lacks control. It could be seen as negligence to leave him unchecked.
For vampires, it's true that they aren't all evil; though that can be a rare sight. It's not right to punish an innocent, though in the Vigilance's defense, it can be hard to distinguish liars.
For werewolves, many of them, even if not evil, have no exercise over their beastiel forms. Sinding is actually a perfect example; while he is a good man, he's a threat to everyone because he lacks control. It could be seen as negligence to leave him unchecked.
- Dark Spark
- Undecided

- Posts: 4746
- Joined: Fri Dec 14, 2007 1:37 am
- ES Games: Oblivion (SI); Skyrim (DB)
- Platform: XBox
- Status: Reality and I aren't on speaking terms right now
- Other Profiles: DarkSpark135
- UESPoints: 5
- Location: Edge of the world and all Western civilization
Re: Is there any GOOD god/characters at all.?
"Walk always towards the Light, or we will drag you to it..." The Vigil's use of maces as their preferred weapon is fitting: When all you have is a hammer, every problem looks like a nail. Force is their tool, force is their plan. Compassion is something they seem to actively avoid— if such as that's a priest's job, not theirs. They garb themselves in righteousness, but they know no other pursuit except violence— their choice of 'victim' just happens to be socially convenient.
It's not even a pursuit for justice: they punish one for the crimes of others committed in the distant past.
At least the Dark Brotherhood is honest about their murderous ways: they enjoy killing in the name of Sithis because the Dread Father demands it. The Vigilants work in the name of Stendarr because killing is so much more fun than not-killing.
It's not even a pursuit for justice: they punish one for the crimes of others committed in the distant past.
At least the Dark Brotherhood is honest about their murderous ways: they enjoy killing in the name of Sithis because the Dread Father demands it. The Vigilants work in the name of Stendarr because killing is so much more fun than not-killing.
Baurus: Our job is to get the Emperor out of situations like this. Though I'll admit, things aren't going exactly to plan.
Casandra: At the moment, the deadliest weapon at my disposal is a goblin's head on a stick. I'd be worried if this was the plan.
Casandra: At the moment, the deadliest weapon at my disposal is a goblin's head on a stick. I'd be worried if this was the plan.
-
OblivionDuruza
- Grand Master

- Posts: 6881
- Joined: Tue Apr 19, 2011 7:44 am
- UESPoints: 5
Re: Is there any GOOD god/characters at all.?
I think it's very wrong to call the 3rd Dominion 'evil', or to call Ulfric 'good'. For starters, the Dominion encompasses a much wider group of 'people' than the Thalmor, and if you happen to be a non-human the chances are that you probably support the Dominion and Thalmor. The Thalmor would have to fall in a similar category to Tiber Septim, because the two are definitely comparable in goals and actions.
Additionally, I would say that it's probably inaccurate to describe the majority of Daedra as 'evil' as well. For example, just because Peryite is thought to take pleasure in inflicting his followers with disease, doesn't necessarily imply that he does this maliciously or with intent to cause them harm. As another example, Mephala, isn't listed as one of the Daedra generally considered demonic in On Oblivion.
Although St Alessia did free human slaves, I don't think that the Elves would view her as being particularly 'good'. The Alessian rebellion and subsequent rule by man was definitely militant, although I think it is fair enough to say that she personally gets a bit of a free ride on that.
Barenziah is also not someone I would necessarily describe as 'good', as I think she probably fits in as a more 'neutral' character based on her incredibly vivid backstory and role in Tamriel's political history.
Additionally, I would say that it's probably inaccurate to describe the majority of Daedra as 'evil' as well. For example, just because Peryite is thought to take pleasure in inflicting his followers with disease, doesn't necessarily imply that he does this maliciously or with intent to cause them harm. As another example, Mephala, isn't listed as one of the Daedra generally considered demonic in On Oblivion.
Although St Alessia did free human slaves, I don't think that the Elves would view her as being particularly 'good'. The Alessian rebellion and subsequent rule by man was definitely militant, although I think it is fair enough to say that she personally gets a bit of a free ride on that.
Barenziah is also not someone I would necessarily describe as 'good', as I think she probably fits in as a more 'neutral' character based on her incredibly vivid backstory and role in Tamriel's political history.
- Maxrebo
- Journeyman

- Posts: 285
- Joined: Thu Jun 11, 2009 8:04 pm
- ES Games: Arena-Beaten,Daggerfall-Beaten,Battlespire-beaten,Redguard-Still haven't Beaten,Morrowind GOTY-beaten,OblivionGOTY-beaten,Skyrim and its DLC Xbox360-Beaten,ESO-Beaten except DLC(PS4)
- Platform: PC,PS4,Xbox One
- Location: Rhode Island
Re: Is there any GOOD god/characters at all.?
I put Ulfric as neutral because at best he's a misguided freedom fighter indirectly playing to the hands of the Thalmor and at worst a racist power grabbing despot.As for the Daedra I put them into Good,Neutral and Evil based purely on my opinion of them,their spheres and actions.Good for the Daedra who have done some good or at least seem to genuinely care about their followers,Neutral for ones that are more unpredictable but mostly harmless and evil for Daedra whose action are generally always harmful and cause great suffering.
Alessia gets a pass for freeing the human slaves and its hard to tie her up with the worst of the Alessia Empire since most of that is tied to Marukh and the Alessian Order.The Alessian Order being a racist,militant,group of religious zealots which really make them no better than the 4th Era Thalmor and elements of the Tribunal Temple in particular the Ordinators
.I consider Barenziah mostly good but with the some grey areas but in the ES Universe that's about the best you can truly expect from a good character cause your just not gonna really find a dyed in the wool goody two shoes in the TES.
When put the Third Aldmeri Dominon as evil I mostly meant the Thalmor mostly because they made an issue of something that wasn't an issue (Talos Worship),started a war over attacks by a paramilitary organization that empire had severed ties with and had no control over,their racism.There rise to in their own country,the coup against the government of Valenwood,taking advantage of the Khajiit's religious beliefs and hints at massacres committed by them against the Bosmer and Altmer Refugees in Hammerfell.Who stands against them or at least severed ties even among their own people,the Psijic Order for example and more prominent and respected members of Altmeri society and not all of those can be standing against them solely for the sake of defending the older order of thing in the Summersett Isle,some of it has got to stem from disagreements or objections to the Thalmor's beliefs and goals. That's why I consider them evil and the Empire in a more positive light because the Empire for the most part was massive step up from the Interregnum and even though its was dominated by the races of man the Elves were still given a lot of leeway and maintained a lot more rights than humans under elven rule not to mention Septim didn't go out of his way to persecute their religious beliefs.I also wonder how they would fair the Sload or Maomer decided to attack Alinor if both the Imperial Navy and the Psijic's were unwilling to help them at least without conditions being met how quickly their "Supporters" in the Alinor would turn on them.
In my mind the two races with any real right to complain about the Empire are the Khajiit (Due the Trans Niben Deal) and the Argonians's (Due to the Blackwood Incursions and an unwillingness to take a hard stance against Dunmer enslavement of Argonians and Khajiit nor making an effort to stop Dunmer Slave Raids into Blackmarsh.
Alessia gets a pass for freeing the human slaves and its hard to tie her up with the worst of the Alessia Empire since most of that is tied to Marukh and the Alessian Order.The Alessian Order being a racist,militant,group of religious zealots which really make them no better than the 4th Era Thalmor and elements of the Tribunal Temple in particular the Ordinators
.I consider Barenziah mostly good but with the some grey areas but in the ES Universe that's about the best you can truly expect from a good character cause your just not gonna really find a dyed in the wool goody two shoes in the TES.
When put the Third Aldmeri Dominon as evil I mostly meant the Thalmor mostly because they made an issue of something that wasn't an issue (Talos Worship),started a war over attacks by a paramilitary organization that empire had severed ties with and had no control over,their racism.There rise to in their own country,the coup against the government of Valenwood,taking advantage of the Khajiit's religious beliefs and hints at massacres committed by them against the Bosmer and Altmer Refugees in Hammerfell.Who stands against them or at least severed ties even among their own people,the Psijic Order for example and more prominent and respected members of Altmeri society and not all of those can be standing against them solely for the sake of defending the older order of thing in the Summersett Isle,some of it has got to stem from disagreements or objections to the Thalmor's beliefs and goals. That's why I consider them evil and the Empire in a more positive light because the Empire for the most part was massive step up from the Interregnum and even though its was dominated by the races of man the Elves were still given a lot of leeway and maintained a lot more rights than humans under elven rule not to mention Septim didn't go out of his way to persecute their religious beliefs.I also wonder how they would fair the Sload or Maomer decided to attack Alinor if both the Imperial Navy and the Psijic's were unwilling to help them at least without conditions being met how quickly their "Supporters" in the Alinor would turn on them.
In my mind the two races with any real right to complain about the Empire are the Khajiit (Due the Trans Niben Deal) and the Argonians's (Due to the Blackwood Incursions and an unwillingness to take a hard stance against Dunmer enslavement of Argonians and Khajiit nor making an effort to stop Dunmer Slave Raids into Blackmarsh.
-
Dunmerdude
- Journeyman

- Posts: 215
- Joined: Wed Mar 19, 2008 7:00 pm
- ES Games: Arena, Daggerfall, Morrowind, Oblivion, Skyrim
- Platform: Xbox 360,PC
Re: Is there any GOOD god/characters at all.?
The Daedra are True Neutral. They're beyond a human understanding of morality. Calling them evil is like calling someone a mass murderer for walking on grass.
Institutions such as Guilds and Governments can't be labeled as good or evil since intent only be judged by individual. With the exception of the Dark Brotherhood I suppose. (On the grounds of child murder for pay)
Unambiguous evil is actually pretty rare in the Elder Scrolls. Jager Tarn, Mankar Camoran and Miraak are evil because their actions were reprehensible and done purely to amass power for the sake of power. The Dragons, as Parthunax admits, are instinctively driven to evil acts.
Most people can be considered neutral because the evil of their actions is subjective. For example, an Argonian would justifiably see House Dres as evil. A native Dunmer noble would likely disagree with that assessment.
Institutions such as Guilds and Governments can't be labeled as good or evil since intent only be judged by individual. With the exception of the Dark Brotherhood I suppose. (On the grounds of child murder for pay)
Unambiguous evil is actually pretty rare in the Elder Scrolls. Jager Tarn, Mankar Camoran and Miraak are evil because their actions were reprehensible and done purely to amass power for the sake of power. The Dragons, as Parthunax admits, are instinctively driven to evil acts.
Most people can be considered neutral because the evil of their actions is subjective. For example, an Argonian would justifiably see House Dres as evil. A native Dunmer noble would likely disagree with that assessment.
Abagaianye An [False] Agea Ada
-
MidbossVyers
- Guardian

- Posts: 781
- Joined: Mon Aug 27, 2012 2:36 pm
- ES Games: Daggerfall, Oblivion, Skyrim
- Platform: PC, PS4, Nintendo Switch
Re: Is there any GOOD god/characters at all.?
Well, dragons seem similar to the Daedra, in that, before Paarthurnax, no Dragon consider what they did as actually "evil". You hear about the "great evil" of the Dragon Priests (human priests who serve the Dragons), but once you get to Solstheim, Vahlok is considered the hero of the story for his loyalty to the Dragons and opposition to Miraak. In fact, most of the evil that I hear the Dragons committed appeared to be committed by their human priests in order to appease the Dragons, such as Rahgot's command for mass suicide in Forelhost and Kahvozein's love of really sharp knives.
-
Dunmerdude
- Journeyman

- Posts: 215
- Joined: Wed Mar 19, 2008 7:00 pm
- ES Games: Arena, Daggerfall, Morrowind, Oblivion, Skyrim
- Platform: Xbox 360,PC
Re: Is there any GOOD god/characters at all.?
Dragons are still driven towards treachery and mass murder, the evil committed by the priests is just flattery by imitation. Daedra reckon humanity as beneath notice. Dragons know what wrong is and are instinctively driven to it.MidbossVyers wrote:Well, dragons seem similar to the Daedra, in that, before Paarthurnax, no Dragon consider what they did as actually "evil". You hear about the "great evil" of the Dragon Priests (human priests who serve the Dragons), but once you get to Solstheim, Vahlok is considered the hero of the story for his loyalty to the Dragons and opposition to Miraak. In fact, most of the evil that I hear the Dragons committed appeared to be committed by their human priests in order to appease the Dragons, such as Rahgot's command for mass suicide in Forelhost and Kahvozein's love of really sharp knives.
Abagaianye An [False] Agea Ada
-
MidbossVyers
- Guardian

- Posts: 781
- Joined: Mon Aug 27, 2012 2:36 pm
- ES Games: Daggerfall, Oblivion, Skyrim
- Platform: PC, PS4, Nintendo Switch
Re: Is there any GOOD god/characters at all.?
No creature is born knowing good or evil. Dragons were doing the thing that they are doing from the moment they were born, but yes, Paarthurnax realized it and then betrayed Alduin.
- Pilaf The Defiler
- Imperial Legate

- Posts: 4359
- Joined: Sat Nov 26, 2011 9:03 pm
- ES Games: Arena, Daggerfall, Morrowind, Oblivion, Skyrim, ESO
- Platform: PC, Xbox, Xbox 360
- Status: Fresh
- UESPoints: 20
Re: Is there any GOOD god/characters at all.?
The Dragons were really beyond Good and Evil, when there were just Dragons and no Mortals on Mundus. When they dominated and killed one another, it was seen as natural. When they did the same to the tiny mortals who couldn't fight back, that's when it became bullying and murder, and good deities like Kyne and Mara took pity on mortals, and personally besought some of Alduin's top lieutenants to see things differently.
In this parable, morality enters the stage when mortality enters the stage. When you introduce a being with less power and defense than the Dragon, it adds a new dynamic. Beings like Paarthurnax were able to empathize because of the wisdom of the Divines, and chose Good, a concept that had been meaningless to them previously.
In this parable, morality enters the stage when mortality enters the stage. When you introduce a being with less power and defense than the Dragon, it adds a new dynamic. Beings like Paarthurnax were able to empathize because of the wisdom of the Divines, and chose Good, a concept that had been meaningless to them previously.
Monsters are bred in labyrinths, labyrinths are bred from walls. There is a reason the Giants choose to remain nomadic rather than follow their shield kin the Nords in building permanent settlements. The Tower is the beginning of all walls.
-
MidbossVyers
- Guardian

- Posts: 781
- Joined: Mon Aug 27, 2012 2:36 pm
- ES Games: Daggerfall, Oblivion, Skyrim
- Platform: PC, PS4, Nintendo Switch
Re: Is there any GOOD god/characters at all.?
Exactly. It's mortal hubris to place nonhuman creatures on human moral standards, especially before mortals even existed.