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I've just listened to most of a radio show, where a British MP banged on about the harmful effects of videogames, and why games like GTAIV shouldn't be made - that developers are irresponsible, and are purely driven by making a quick buck.

We have a fairly broad demographic of gamers here on the UESP, from ages 12 to over 40, from Wii lovers to a small selection of zealous hardcore, from PC-heads to purely console owners - a broad range of people, liking a broad range of games, irrespective of age or gender.

With that in mind, the simplistic anti-games lobby's point seems to be: violent videogames make kids grow up into thieves and killers, so they shouldn't be made.

Right? Or wrong? Should anything go? Or should more control over content and access be brought in?

I don't think violent games make kids grow up to be thieves and killers, as most people are able to distinguish between reality and fantasy (probably sounds weird coming from the OP of the Hottest Argonian thread). Also, the ESRB rates games based on the ages they are suitable for:
EC - 3 and over
E - 6 and over
E10+ - 10 and over
T- 13 and over
M - 17 and over
AO - no one under 18

With this system in place parents should be able to control what their kids play and only let them play a game if they feel it's suitable. If a child is exposed to content too mature for him/her, then it is probably the parent's fault.

I'll spare everyone of my usual long winded-ness and state my opinion in the simplest way possible.

Violent video games are becoming the cheap excuse for parents, teachers, and role-models that want to avoid admitting their own failure in those roles.

Video-game players do not turn into criminals because of the games they play. They already were criminals waiting to make a move.

I dont think games turn people into killers. people turn people into killers. if movies and games like doom turned people into killers dont you think we would all be dead by now? millions worldwide play video games and you know how many of them turn to crime? Only a very small percentage and thats even smaller compared to the billions of people out there who have never played a single video game in their life. come on Hitler never played a single video game and he was the most ruthless person out there. Games do not turn people into killers people turn people into killers.

the video games don't cause the people to do the things, because most people have SELF CONTROL! Most people who would have video games cause them to kill people are already mentally unstable and shouldn't be in society in the first place.

The Tourist wrote:I've just listened to most of a radio show, where a British MP banged on about the harmful effects of videogames,

Is this the first one you've ever heard? Because my local radio station gets them bi-weekly.

I honestly don't think they make people violent, or most people. Some people can get wrapped up in the games and take aspects from them into real life.
I once read about a guy who played a game called something like "Manslaughter", and then decided he'd play this game for real, he ended up killing his friend...
But I think rather than making games less violent they should just prohibit these people from playing games.
As for younger gamers, I shouldn't even need to say this, look at the age rating.
And being pressured into it by your kid is no excuse, if they don't know that no means no then teach them.
Unless you know that your kid is mature enough to deal with the things in the game, in which case you should still be wary.
And while games may have an influence on how kids turn out later in life, I think it'san extremely minor influence when it's compared to what they're exposed to everywhere else. TV and just plain going outside are probably the major ones, the former of which already has had all sorts of problems, and a few solutions have already been presented. (i.e. Pin codes etc.)
But going outside is something that can't be helped, and the only way to clean it up is through fixing your city/community's problems. Which is hard, and takes a long time, but it's been done before. When I first moved into my estate there were all sorts of things happening, my area was infamous for drug-dealers and worse. Syringes had been found in the field, a house was broken into every second night and everyone was a little bit too scared to try and fix it.
But someone finally got through to the Town's Council and now, after 5 years, the place is the best it's ever been. There are still some problems, but that's inevitable.

I seem to have gone kind of off topic...
The point I'm trying to make is that while games may have an influence on kids (which can be avoided if you want), it is extremely small, and there are bigger fish to fry in this area.

Err... I think that's all.

GTA makes me want to steal some cars, Oblivion/Morrowind make me want to run someone through with a sword, Need For Speed makes me want to race a car down the road at stupidly fast speeds, Barbie Horse adventures makes me want to dress in pink, dye my hair blonde and talk to horses...

Well, have you ever heard anyone say that? I haven't... The Hypothetical case, as they say, has been firmly rested on the table of Justice.

Surely this works both ways, so I could argue against the MP, saying The Sims makes kids want to grow up, have a family, and find a job. Besides, there were more crimes before videogames... because the children were out knifing someone, instead of playing videogames.

I've heard this one before, usually it comes from teachers and politicians. The politicians just want to get their fat deceptive asses back in office and will say anything to make people think that they care.

Agreed. I have one more thing to say.... Have you ever noticed that the people who criticize video games have never played them themselves? I mean how can you say something is evil if you do not even know what it is?

Politicians are just old idiots who think their way is right because they have the power. As for teachers, instead of going on about violent video games just teach parents about the rating system. Is that so hard you are teachers after all.

King, your post count is 1234

Anyway, coming from a person that plays video games 6-14 hours daily, the only thing video games changed about me (for the better) is:

Hobbies
Reflexes
Hand-eye coordination
Quick wit

Are any of those going to make me a bad person? First, the government funds a video game company to make a military FPS and now they're claiming that the video game industry makes people homicidal? Which, I should add, is now larger than the movie and music industries? I'll bet anyone that a 3rd grader can identify Master Chief before George W. Bush, or even Jesus.

ace62394 wrote:King, your post count is 1234

Anyway, coming from a person that plays video games 6-14 hours daily, the only thing video games changed about me (for the better) is:

Hobbies
Reflexes
Hand-eye coordination
Quick wit

Are any of those going to make me a bad person? First, the government funds a video game company to make a military FPS and now they're claiming that the video game industry makes people homicidal? Which, I should add, is now larger than the movie and music industries? I'll bet anyone that a 3rd grader can identify Master Chief before George W. Bush, or even Jesus.

I agree with the identifying, but not for the latter. who doesn't know about Jesus, don't turn this into religeon though.

Have you watched Supersize Me? They took little kids and each one identified Ronald McDonald and the Wendy's girl but none of them could figure out a picture of Jesus or George Washington

That's sad, yet not suprising and funny in a shallow sort of way.

Nope they don't cause me to do anything out of the ordinarry like killing but I am absolutely addicted to them. Now then back to trying to get 1000 kills with my M14 in COD4 so than I can have red tiger camo.

1,000 kills, are you crazy?

A little Cod4 here.

For Assault Rifles

25 kills= Red Dot sight
75 kills=Silencer
150 kills= ACOG scope

25 headshots= Digital camo
75 headshots= blue tiger camo
150 headshots- red tiger camo

Unless that is the pc version or something.

Maybe it was a personal goal?

ace62394 wrote:Have you watched Supersize Me? They took little kids and each one identified Ronald McDonald and the Wendy's girl but none of them could figure out a picture of Jesus or George Washington

Well thats because that is a common appearence, Do you walk down the street and see Billboards that say "Jesus Loves", but, again, lets not turn this into religion.

I don't think that video games have a major or even minor impact on how you act. I mean, I'm 12 and I have played Grand Theft Auto, and I have the Deadly Reflex mod for Oblvion. Just the other day I walked into the movie theater, and I looked at the movie listings, and I said, "It is a sad day for the movie theater."
My mom asked, "Why is that?".
I looked at her and said, "There are currently no R-rated movies playing."

Okay so that story isn't really relevant, I just thought it was pretty funny.

Same with me Alien. I'm 12 and don't have this sudden urge to find the sluttiest prostitute in downtown chicago and then kill 12 people and highjack a car. I agree with some people who have posted that it really is just an excuse for bad parenting. I mean, kids around me are more influenced by the US army commercials than games like grand theft auto. I mean it does get annoying how people rant about how much they influence us. It's like kids saying, "Adults should never drink coffee. Or drink alcohol" . It's things we don't know that much about because it's completely out of our league. Adults don't know if GTA games are going to make bad kids. My mom has no problem with us playing GTAIV. She even watched me get a private dance at the strip club, and yet I feel horrible doing anything I'm not supposed to, I'm polite, my friends and their parents like me, and I get straight A's. Sometimes video games like GTAIV can be good in a way. It's hard to be a goody good good all the time. People use shooting games and violent games like this sort of as an outlet. To get this violence out of them in a peaceful way (wow, can you say ironic). The kids who are violent kids are that way because of bad parenting. Well that's at least my opinion.

I have tried to make a simple mathematic equation to describe this argument, because I was (really) bored.

v = video games
c = children
p = parent
g = good
b = bad
I = insane
S = Sane

v + Sc + gp = Sc
v + Sc + bp = Sc
v + Ic + gp = Sc
v + Ic + bp = Ic
So:
Sc > Ic
gp > bp
There you go!

You only proved what I said about the small percentage of people.

I have to admit: Vice City did give me the urge to corner a Testarossa at 60 mph.

And I learned how to dance from Sid Meier's Pirates!. As well as wearing to close with the eye of the wind in a brigantine-rigged gunship. You know, just in case I ever need to rake a galleon.

Chu-ban!

I think that violence in any media can desensitise us.

Vid games are becoming increasingly more realistic. Before they were v. basic and blocky. Now, in some cases at least, that is actually a full representation of another human that you are inflicting violence on (I’m only talking about the more violent types here).

Isn’t it the case that kids that grow up in a violent environment are more prone to turning to violence as an adult? (I ask because though I’ve heard this, I’ve never actually verified it by going looking for stats or anything.) One day vid games will be able to be at the point of being a 3D fully realistic person that we can inflict any kind of violence on.

I think no one really knows if or what impact any games might have. Maybe some people can use them as good and effective stress relievers.

Personally, certainly during childhood at least, I think they are at best neutral. I think it unlikely that many people turn out kinder, more thoughtful/considerate to others etc due to a childhood of violent vid games.

I'm 13,so i play a good lot,not half as many as i used to admittedly,but i don't want to go on a killin spree in NY,i don't know how to handle a gun and wouldn't have the guts to pull the trigger on someone, anyway,I'd just think of all those years in jail afterwords

But,my brother,9 years old,plays my games,18+ 16+ all them,he's picks up loads of swear language, and sometimes,after playing COD4 he'll go ask my mum for a pellet gun,lol.

So,it doesn't affect me,but i think it might affect people who are younger,but of course,they shouldn't be allowed to play them,my fault

OMG, I just played Halo 3, now I'm gonna go outside and kill some grunts, and by grunts I mean innocent people. Then I'm gonna steal a car and go pick up a prostitute so I can kill him and take my money back!

No, seriously I don't see why people make such a big deal out of games. Criminals existed thousands of years before videogames, before even electricity or circuit boards!

As far as their effects on children, people should be more resonsible about what they buy their children! I've lost track of how many times I've sold GTA games to people who were buying them for their elementary school age children. I was unable to do anything about it because the person purchasing the game was old enough to buy it. If it had been a pack of cigarettes, I would have been allowed by management to decline the sale, but not for an M - rated video game or R -rated movie. Gotta make those Benjamins for the big wigs to wipe their butts with.

I think that videogames can be good as a stress reliever, so that I don't want to grab a gun, a car and kill random people in the street. Instead, I can grab a controller, a friend and kill a pretend version of him in the street.