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The place for general discussion about everyone's favourite products of the blood of Padomay.

Something I find interesting is that in The Annotated Anuad, it says that the blood of Padomay became the Daedra (Padomay being the Evil Twin), and the mingled blood of Anu and Padomay became the Aedra, hence their capacity for good and evil. That seems to imply that the Daedra can only be evil, but that's clearly not true: look at Azura. Look at Sheogorath, even! Even though he's one of the four corners, he's actually relatively harmless. Chaotic, definitely. Evil? No.

I'd attribute in my mind, the biased of some books to reflect how some books in real life would be. Biased against the Daedra, pro for the Aedra. Imagine a clergyman for the Nine.

This-- to me --is proven when in Oblivion, the Redguard mage in Cheydinhal saying that '[the] Daedra aren't necessarily evil,' and our first hand experiences with Azura and Sheogorath.

Refering to all of them as "evil" is, I always thought, just a form of condemnation for their frequent meddling in the afairs of mortals, and the far-reaching consequences that generally result. This can be applied to both extremes: Azura, frequently viewed as good by mortal standards, has absolutely no reason to harm mortals. By helping them instead, she seems to accomplish more of her own goals than any of the less personable Princes. On the other hand, Princes such as Mehrunes Dagon, who could truly be considered evil, simply personify a negative component of human nature. It's like calling Hades or Ares evil just because they personify death and war. It's simply the aspect that they represent.

The Aedra, on the other hand, tend to be far more reserved in their meddling. They rarely interact with mortals, and when they do, it's in times of great or even dire need. This, I feel, has a greater appeal to mortals; we have higher beings who will protect us if/when the need arises, but they aren't there watching and controling our every move like the Daedra seem to do.

Dogmantra wrote:The place for general discussion about everyone's favourite products of the blood of Padomay.

Something I find interesting is that in The Annotated Anuad, it says that the blood of Padomay became the Daedra (Padomay being the Evil Twin), and the mingled blood of Anu and Padomay became the Aedra, hence their capacity for good and evil. That seems to imply that the Daedra can only be evil, but that's clearly not true: look at Azura. Look at Sheogorath, even! Even though he's one of the four corners, he's actually relatively harmless. Chaotic, definitely. Evil? No.

He did nearly carnage Vivec with that big rock...

I always thought that the evil associated with the Daedra is just propaganda, for want of a better word, from the more intrinsically 'good' religions of Tamriel, like the Nine Divines and the Tribunal Temple, both of whom are strongly opposed to the Daedra. They depict the Daedra as evil so people will stay with the good religions. I mean, how can you possibly say that Meridia, for instance, is evil?

I find it interesting that the Daedra Princes have no gender, yet they're called princes.

How is that interesting? It's standard English practice to assume masculinity when talking about something of an unknown gender/sex, par exemple, say I tell you about my friend Ashley ('s an androgynous name!), the correct thing to do would be to refer to him as "he" until I you're told otherwise.

It's just common sense.

Um, not really. Azura doesn't sound male. I could see for Boethiah or Zenithar, and it still doesn't make sense as to why they're all nonsexual. If that's the word I want.

The one that always got me was Clavicus. Clavicus sounds
like a Roman male name to me, but the voice... Anyway, I
digress.

Dlarsh wrote:This, that, an' the other.

I agree. It makes a whole lot more sense to see the Daedra
as evil, when you put evil in the context of meddling and
self-serving ideals.

@Vivec:
Unisex, I think, would work.

Vivec's Tears wrote:Um, not really. Azura doesn't sound male. I could see for Boethiah or Zenithar, and it still doesn't make sense as to why they're all nonsexual. If that's the word I want.

Only because that's how they choose to appear. Azura could show up any way she wants to, she doesn't have to be female. Her title wouldn't change depending on whatever random avatar she chooses to appear as, so it goes to "Prince." It is indeed common sense.

Cactus wrote:

Vivec's Tears wrote:Um, not really. Azura doesn't sound male. I could see for Boethiah or Zenithar, and it still doesn't make sense as to why they're all nonsexual. If that's the word I want.

Only because that's how they choose to appear. Azura could show up any way she wants to, she doesn't have to be female. Her title wouldn't change depending on whatever random avatar she chooses to appear as, so it goes to "Prince." It is indeed common sense.

I still disagree. It's almost like saying "they" for someone who's gender you don't know. But I digress.

Go read up on alignments in Dungeons and Dragons then look at all the princes and match them up.

Agares wrote:Go read up on alignments in Dungeons and Dragons then look at all the princes and match them up.

[whine]But 4e removed half of them![/whine]

Hmmm... With the 3.5 system, this could actually be quite interesting...

Vivec's Tears wrote:Um, not really. Azura doesn't sound male. I could see for Boethiah or Zenithar, and it still doesn't make sense as to why they're all nonsexual. If that's the word I want.

i actually thought boehiah was a woman until i got to his shrine and took a close look at his statue

Vivec's Tears wrote:Um, not really. Azura doesn't sound male. I could see for Boethiah or Zenithar, and it still doesn't make sense as to why they're all nonsexual. If that's the word I want.

OMG!
How can you say Zenithar sounds female? It sounds like the name of some very hairy scandinavian butcher!
Besides we're talking about Daedra here...

Also someone here said that the Temple was a good religion that disapproves with Daedra worship...
That's not exactly true. They disapprove with 4 Daedra, endorce 3 and are neutral with the other 7...
And they're not realy a good religion... They persecute people!

I'm saying Boethiah and Zenithar are fairly unisexual sounding names.

I'm wondering what Hermaeus Mora's name translates as? It's something in the old Ehlnofex language (like Molag Bal - translates as 'Firestone'). 'Mora' means 'Forest' (Balmora - Stone Forest, Sadrith Mora - Mushroom Forest, Morag Tong - Foresters' Guild) but I can't find a translation for 'Hermaeus'.

I'm thinking hermeus = hermit, since the hermit is, in tarot depicted holding a lamp outward in search of forbidden knowledge, and since hermeticism requires spiritual solitude, his shrine's locations in tamriel are well placed!

"Hermit forest"? No, it seems a bit odd to say the least. At least "Firestone" for a Daedra generally associated with evil such as Molag Bal is quite fitting. I reckon it could be "Knowledge" or something like that.

r wrote:"Hermit forest"? No, it seems a bit odd to say the least. At least "Firestone" for a Daedra generally associated with evil such as Molag Bal is quite fitting. I reckon it could be "Knowledge" or something like that.

Yeah, but it doesn't neccesary need to have any related meaning...
Bal Molagmer for example...
What do honorable thives have to do with "Stone Fire Men"?

Ah, but that could be a Molag Bal reference again...

I was thinking maybe more along the lines of "Forest Hermit" since he, according to lore, is one who hides in the woods and captures wanderers

r wrote:Ah, but that could be a Molag Bal reference again...

Was do, then, honorable thives have to do with the King of Rape?

Also yeah, I second that hermit thing...
Otherwise Mora doesn't make any sense, but like most of it, it doesn't anyway...

Hermaeus? "Ugly green pointless blob with claws sticking out that should be humanoid like the others"? Seriously, why did he choose to live as a blob? How does he read all the books from his library?

kertaw48 wrote:

r wrote:Ah, but that could be a Molag Bal reference again...

Was do, then, honorable thives have to do with the King of Rape?

Gentleman Jim Stacey has a sense of irony?

Tom10320 wrote:Hermaeus? "Ugly green pointless blob with claws sticking out that should be humanoid like the others"?

The same...

Seriously, why did he choose to live as a blob? How does he read all the books from his library?

He still has claws...