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 Post subject: Elder Scrolls Lore Versus thread
PostPosted: Sun Aug 04, 2013 3:44 am 
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I was a littke hesitant to make this thread but figured I would try it out. The idea is that anyone can post a matchup between any 2+ people or groups from TES Lore and we discuss who would win. I'll get it started: whay do you guys thibk the resulr would be if Pelinal Whitestrake fought Nerevar and the mortal Tribunal.

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 Post subject: Re: Elder Scrolls Lore Versus thread
PostPosted: Sun Aug 04, 2013 7:27 am 
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hmmmm that would be a good fight, I feel like pelinal would win but I don't why haha. I've always wondered who would win in a
Dark Brotherhood all out fiht. the Brotherhood from Oblivion or the newer one from Skyrim? The newer group has new spells and powers and such but the old group was just more skilled by sticking to the tenants......


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 Post subject: Re: Elder Scrolls Lore Versus thread
PostPosted: Sun Aug 04, 2013 1:28 pm 
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I would be interested to see who would win: Mage's Guild vs Fighter's Guild.

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 Post subject: Moderator post
PostPosted: Sun Aug 04, 2013 4:30 pm 
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I'm not entirely sure this isn't a "forum game," which is against the rules. I think it could be an interesting comparison thread, but only if you can present topics from each game/guild to support you post. That being said, make sure you give some real concrete in-game reasons for why you'd support your side.

For example...
What I wouldn't want to see:
A member wrote:
Yeah man Mages Guild would kick the Fighters Guild butts!


What would be better to see:
A member wrote:
Well, the Mages Guild has magic on their side, and they could easily kick the Fighters' butts. Especially Oblivion-era Fighters Guild, who was sort of weakened anyway in numbers and all thanks to the Blackwood Company's competition. But magic can't stop a sword to the face!


So, give us some real discussion, avoid the forum game feeling, and this thread should be super. ;)

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 Post subject: Re: Elder Scrolls Lore Versus thread
PostPosted: Sun Aug 04, 2013 6:45 pm 
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Depending on several factors, it could be an even draw. The Mages Guild does not just consist of mages. They also have Battlemages. If the battle was fought from range, they would win due to magic being a lot more powerful then arrows. If the Fighter's Guild charged, they could end up charging straight into traps or end up having to fight many summoned creatures. The battlemages would be the most dangerous part of the battle for the FG and would have to take them out first but would lose many fighters per battlemages. However, the fighter's guild is used to battles and would possess a lot of battle tatics. They would know how to deal with mages and would most likely use divide and conquer tatics. But it would come down to who has the better general.

Unless a demigod gets involved or Sheogorath decides to turn them all into sweetrolls just for the fun of it. Or a certain S'wit scolds them for fighting.

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 Post subject: Re: Elder Scrolls Lore Versus thread
PostPosted: Sun Aug 04, 2013 8:34 pm 
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If they were to actually get in a fight for whatever reason, The Mages Guild could always just retreat to the Arcane University,camp out inside, and summon Daedric Creatures to battle the Fighters Guild outside the gates.

in the end, I don't see how the Fighters Guild could win. :S

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 Post subject: Re: Elder Scrolls Lore Versus thread
PostPosted: Sun Aug 04, 2013 9:44 pm 
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To be honest, the Mages Guild holds more of the potential to be more dangerous, but unless war calls for it, they are less battle ready and experienced. Keep in mind most of it's members are scholars and prefer to keep to their studies. While many could resort to summons of daedra, it's always a probability that this can backfire<_<
As it stands in the moment, the battlemages are the true fighting force. They express more battle experience and are hardened for combat. You can't simply consider skill, but also mental. Those who experience battle are thus more likely to cope and react

As for the Fighter's Guild, they may not hold the same level of potential as the mages', but they are far more experienced and adept for battle. They are widely open for use to the public, and thus confront many of the dangers present to the locals. While they themselves can't compare to an actual army, I am certain their tactics are no different. As we should know, tactics and cunning can overcome sheer power.
While some it's members come from the Legion, it's not to say green recruits are not hard to find. It's far easier for a normal farmer to pick up a sword and want to join the Fighter's than the same said person wanting to be a mage. I also suspect in the public's eyes, the Fighters are more popular. Why? Many of them go off to protect them, and defending a farm from goblins may just as well impress someone to join. It's not often you see a mage go out and kill some pesky bandits.
Yes their competition has been confronting their recruitment and contracts, but the mage's have their own challenges.

In conclusion>_> I find it hard to say who would ultimately win. The two have their strengths and weaknesses, however the two I am sure have made advantage of the other in terms of contracts and missions

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 Post subject: Re: Elder Scrolls Lore Versus thread
PostPosted: Sun Aug 04, 2013 10:38 pm 
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Interesting thread, since there is many Mage's Guilds and Fighter Guilds across Tamriel, I will just compare Oblivion's. The Mage's guild is better equipped, and more supported by the Empire (Educated Guess: They have their own university in the Imperial City. But they only have so many mages, since a lot of the are less combat orientated and more towards scholars. I believe the Fighter Guild would win, as everyone is a skilled warrior.

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 Post subject: Re: Elder Scrolls Lore Versus thread
PostPosted: Sun Aug 04, 2013 11:44 pm 
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While on this thread<_< I'll like to ask
Of each of the Dragon Priests in skyrim, which one is the strongest? I'll like to exclude those of the DLC >_>
I could just as easily say Morokei due to having the staff, but that's too simple. I also doubt he's had that staff for long due to it's nature.
Considering their powers, skills, and the significance of their ruins. I'll suspect that the more powerful or important of the Dragon Priests would be located in key areas, maybe even symbolizing their strength.

Personally I would like to say Nahkriin is the most significant<_< especially out of the eight but that's debatable.
Hence as to why I ask, and hence to the topic

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 Post subject: Re: Elder Scrolls Lore Versus thread
PostPosted: Sun Aug 04, 2013 11:51 pm 
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Konahrik? No? Okay, I would say Moroeki because even if he somehow lost the staff, he would still have the magic stolen from mages who entered the sanctum, plus at the moment, he does have it.

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 Post subject: Re: Elder Scrolls Lore Versus thread
PostPosted: Mon Aug 05, 2013 2:15 am 
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First I would like to thank Avron for endorsing my thread and expressing a thought that I have in words better than I could. We need to make sure this thread remains intelligent discussion.
Next I will adress the question asked about the Brotherhood earlier. The Oblivion era Dark Brotherhood would probably destroy the Skyrim era because they had nuch greater numbers (as of Skyrim the group was nearly eradicated) and the followed the Tenets making them more disciplined and dedicated.

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 Post subject: Re: Elder Scrolls Lore Versus thread
PostPosted: Mon Aug 05, 2013 2:26 am 
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I would say Nahkriin, there's a reason Alduin trusted him to guard his portal to Sovnguarde.


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 Post subject: Re: Elder Scrolls Lore Versus thread
PostPosted: Mon Aug 05, 2013 3:52 am 
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well, since we're on the subject of the fighters guild, how do you think they'd fair against the Companions? i feel like the companions would prevail even without using beast form. the Companions have FAR less members, but they only let the greatest warriors join, they are closer to each other than the Fighters Guild, and have newer fighting tactics[such as dual wielding] and have their natural strengths increased due to beast blood. if they DID use beast form....... well that wouldn't be a fight.... i'm not as clear on the FG's strengths so your opinons are great.


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 Post subject: Re: Elder Scrolls Lore Versus thread
PostPosted: Mon Aug 05, 2013 5:57 pm 
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While I like the Companions better than the Fighter's Guild, I don't think the Companions would prevail. The Guild has numbers on their side, and have many members with just as good of training as the Companions. While the Companions DO have a closer bond, as well as the Circle with their special ability, they couldn't even prevent the Silver Hand (who are little better than bandits) from getting to the Harbinger. For this reason, I have to give it to the Fighter's Guild.

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 Post subject: Re: Elder Scrolls Lore Versus thread
PostPosted: Mon Aug 05, 2013 6:02 pm 
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You do realise that Kodlak was both old and sick, right?

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 Post subject: Re: Elder Scrolls Lore Versus thread
PostPosted: Mon Aug 05, 2013 6:20 pm 
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DragonoftheNorth wrote:
Next I will adress the question asked about the Brotherhood earlier. The Oblivion era Dark Brotherhood would probably destroy the Skyrim era because they had nuch greater numbers (as of Skyrim the group was nearly eradicated) and the followed the Tenets making them more disciplined and dedicated.

I don't know about that. Considering the fact that the Cyrodiil Brotherhood almost got wiped out by one guy, I think Skyrim would would be able to defeat them. (I am not including the PCs for either game, so Astrid's betrayal would have never happened.

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 Post subject: Re: Elder Scrolls Lore Versus thread
PostPosted: Mon Aug 05, 2013 6:34 pm 
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~Sadly for the later<_< I have to say the Fighter's would win against the Companions, namely due to one consisting of a larger organization yet both have "similar" traits
~As for the Dark Brotherhood showdown.. I have to give it to the those who followed the tenets. Yes they nearly got wiped off by a single man, but he planned everything out and worked his way up the ladder<_< nearly any strong organization could fall prey to this trick. The main reason I see they'll do better is simply because they weren't just a group of assassins, they were somebody to fear. For starters<_< they had the Night Mother and even Black Marsh's support. They need not listen to lowly rumors for contracts, they just got it from the source<_< and I must admit the Shadowscales are a force to admire. The tenets kept them organized, loyal to the band not just an individual.

While the remnants may be strong, even they admit their struggling. If not for them using the name of the guild, I am certain the guards would of wiped them off sooner<_< but it's the fact that people fear the guild alone that keeps them safe.. till they [&@%!] off the wrong guy. If a single guy nearly wiped out the guild in oblivion, I suspect it would be just as much easier to do it in a smaller group<_< seeing as they rely heavily on rumors for contracts, it wouldn't be hard to set a trap either

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 Post subject: Re: Elder Scrolls Lore Versus thread
PostPosted: Mon Aug 05, 2013 9:17 pm 
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Just to chime in I think it would be in everyone's best interest if I made a rule barring Daedric Princes and the Divines from being participants because there is no easy reasoning to determine a victor if it's god against god and it would almost certainly turn into an argument based on who likes which better, so no Prince vs Prince or Prince vs Divine battles.

DikaSmausha wrote:
I don't know about that. Considering the fact that the Cyrodiil Brotherhood almost got wiped out by one guy, I think Skyrim would would be able to defeat them. (I am not including the PCs for either game, so Astrid's betrayal would have never happened.

Are you including just the Brotherhood members present in-game in Oblivion? Because if so it would be a toss up, but at the time the Dark Brotherhood was widespread across Tamriel whereas in Skyrim the Falkreath Sanctuary was the last surviving group. If we talk about the entire population of each Brotherhood than Oblivion era dominates solely based on manpower.

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 Post subject: Re: Elder Scrolls Lore Versus thread
PostPosted: Mon Aug 05, 2013 10:12 pm 
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DragonoftheNorth wrote:
Just to chime in I think it would be in everyone's best interest if I made a rule barring Daedric Princes and the Divines from being participants because there is no easy reasoning to determine a victor if it's god against god and it would almost certainly turn into an argument based on who likes which better, so no Prince vs Prince or Prince vs Divine battles.

There's already threads for such topics and debates
I must agree though, steer away from heated topics and think whether there is already a thread dedicated to said debate or info
So a simple rule of thumb<_< don't feed the trolls or flames

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 Post subject: Re: Elder Scrolls Lore Versus thread
PostPosted: Mon Aug 05, 2013 10:27 pm 
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There goes my Dagon vs Alduin debate. :(

The companions would win most of the battles as they only accept people that are skilled enough to pass their test. I suspect in lore, it is very demanding and most people fail the test. The fighter's Guild seems to accept anyone. However, they could have a few battlemages. The Companions do not as they view stealth and magic as the tools of cowards. But they failed to repell the Silver hand which managed to break into Whiterun and slay the Harbinger with just a few men. But I have put that down to poor writing.

As for the Dark Brotherhood, they were almost destroyed by one man.

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 Post subject: Re: Elder Scrolls Lore Versus thread
PostPosted: Mon Aug 05, 2013 11:07 pm 
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Thelastdovah wrote:
As for the Dark Brotherhood, they were almost destroyed by one man.


So were the Daedra of Mehrunes Dagon, and the Dragons of Alduin, and forces of Dagoth Ur.

Why is this important? you are underestimating the power of a single person. the fact that they are defeated doesn't show the weakness of the group, but the strength of the individual.

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 Post subject: Re: Elder Scrolls Lore Versus thread
PostPosted: Mon Aug 05, 2013 11:12 pm 
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Companions vs. Blackwood Company

One hundred drug-crazed mercenaries against a band of honourable Nord warriors/werewolves. I think Blackwood would prevail simply due to the numbers.

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 Post subject: Re: Elder Scrolls Lore Versus thread
PostPosted: Tue Aug 06, 2013 12:18 am 
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I think it Blackwood vs. Companions would be close. I think it would take them a while to march up to Whiterun, and then a lot longer for them to eventually kill all of the Companions off, one by one.
But I do think blackwood would win just out of sheer numbers.

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 Post subject: Re: Elder Scrolls Lore Versus thread
PostPosted: Tue Aug 06, 2013 2:22 am 
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I don't think the numbers would matter as much as training. Look that the Battle of Thermopylae. (I am exaggerating a bit.) I think the Companions would take them.

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 Post subject: Re: Elder Scrolls Lore Versus thread
PostPosted: Tue Aug 06, 2013 2:33 am 
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The Blackwood Company's leaders were hardened veterans. Pretty impressive gear too.

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