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 Post subject: Would Bretons mind if the Thalmor control man?
PostPosted: Sun Aug 18, 2013 7:02 pm 
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As far as I know Bretons are half man half elf. If the Thalmor were to take full control of skyrim and cyrodill and break the empire, with the idea that "elves must dominate man" Would the Bretons protest? They are part elf. How would the thalmor treat them? Consider them impure elves and attack them, or respect them well enough?

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 Post subject: Re: Would Bretons mind if the Thalmor control man?
PostPosted: Sun Aug 18, 2013 7:26 pm 
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This is probably better in TES General. I definitely think they would protest. If the Thalmor took Skyrim, they would be able to take Hammerfell. Then move on to High Rock.

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 Post subject: Re: Would Bretons mind if the Thalmor control man?
PostPosted: Sun Aug 18, 2013 7:46 pm 
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Yeah, they would mind. Just because Bretons are a mixture of man and mer doesn't mean they'll like the Thalmor or that the Thalmor will like them. There are plenty of Altmer that hate the Thalmor let alone other races that hate them.

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 Post subject: Re: Would Bretons mind if the Thalmor control man?
PostPosted: Sun Aug 18, 2013 7:49 pm 
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Bretons are men....you do know that they are more Man than Mer, right? That is how they are, you know, human and not elf. Just throwing that out there.

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 Post subject: Re: Would Bretons mind if the Thalmor control man?
PostPosted: Sun Aug 18, 2013 7:53 pm 
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What Br3admax said.

And I'd think even other elves, like the Dunmer, would mind if the Thalmor came into power.

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 Post subject: Re: Would Bretons mind if the Thalmor control man?
PostPosted: Sun Aug 18, 2013 8:01 pm 
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They would because they are men but they may have elven blood in them. I suspect the Thalmor would accuse the Bretons of stealing magic from Elves as well as their blood. They would most likely treat them like [&@%!] and probably implement many anti-mage rules that only apply to the Bretons due to them being mages.

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 Post subject: Re: Would Bretons mind if the Thalmor control man?
PostPosted: Mon Aug 19, 2013 12:48 am 
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The Black Weasel wrote:
As far as I know Bretons are half man half elf. If the Thalmor were to take full control of skyrim and cyrodill and break the empire, with the idea that "elves must dominate man" Would the Bretons protest? They are part elf. How would the thalmor treat them? Consider them impure elves and attack them, or respect them well enough?


Bretons are like 10% mer not half and half. And yes they would mind they're practically human the thalmor would hate them and bretons have generally been an active part of the empire for centuries.


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 Post subject: Re: Would Bretons mind if the Thalmor control man?
PostPosted: Mon Aug 19, 2013 2:07 am 
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They'd mind very much. They've prospered from the Empire for many centuries and are considered human by everyone. In fact the Kings and Queens of the old Bretony estates were Titus Mede's most fanatical supporters. The good one, not his doddering great grandson who rolled over for the Thalmor.

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 Post subject: Re: Would Bretons mind if the Thalmor control man?
PostPosted: Mon Aug 19, 2013 2:12 am 
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Thelastdovah wrote:
They would because they are men but they may have elven blood in them. I suspect the Thalmor would accuse the Bretons of stealing magic from Elves as well as their blood. They would most likely treat them like [&@%!] and probably implement many anti-mage rules that only apply to the Bretons due to them being mages.

Are you serious? The Elves went around and raped/seduced their nedic slave woman. What does this even mean? None of this makes sense.

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 Post subject: Re: Would Bretons mind if the Thalmor control man?
PostPosted: Mon Aug 19, 2013 1:08 pm 
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Pilaf The Defiler wrote:
They'd mind very much. They've prospered from the Empire for many centuries and are considered human by everyone. In fact the Kings and Queens of the old Bretony estates were Titus Mede's most fanatical supporters. The good one, not his doddering great grandson who rolled over for the Thalmor.

Pretty much what Pilaf said here. Once your personal, political, and economic interests start getting ruined, everyone starts to care. The Thalmor are sort of nice for that - one big party of "Man, those guys suck" with pretty much everyone else in Tamriel. ;)

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 Post subject: Re: Would Bretons mind if the Thalmor control man?
PostPosted: Tue Oct 22, 2013 11:28 pm 
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Bretons would probably be regarded as second class citizens or worse. I don't even think the Altmer think too highly of Bosmer, Dunmer, or especially Orsimer either.


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 Post subject: Re: Would Bretons mind if the Thalmor control man?
PostPosted: Thu Oct 24, 2013 12:10 pm 
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Leckan wrote:
Bretons would probably be regarded as second class citizens or worse. I don't even think the Thalmor think too highly of Bosmer, Dunmer, or especially Orsimer either.


Fixed that for you, not every Altmer is a racist fanatic.


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 Post subject: Re: Would Bretons mind if the Thalmor control man?
PostPosted: Fri Oct 25, 2013 3:21 pm 
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It's already been stated, but just underscoring the fact that Bretons are not "Mer". For one, all of the "Mer" races, with the possible exception of Orsimer have much longer lifespans than the mortal races of man. Even though they're called "Manmer", like the Orsimer, they would more than likely be considered a corruption or "half-breed", not to mention that their innate magic resistance possibly renders them as the greatest threat to the magic wielding Thalmor. My Breton takes no greater pleasure than convincing Thalmor patrols how weak their magic actually is. It's hard to look down your nose when it's getting smashed through the back of your skull.

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 Post subject: Re: Would Bretons mind if the Thalmor control man?
PostPosted: Sun Oct 27, 2013 1:26 pm 
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You have to keep in mind the Direnni interbreeding was thousands of years ago, now. They're simply mostly just humans now. There's been a lot of intermarrying with Nord and Imperial families over the centuries. The Elven blood and culture is very watered down. High Rock pretty much has its own unique race and culture. The Altmer feel no kinship with them and the feeling is mutual.

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 Post subject: Re: Would Bretons mind if the Thalmor control man?
PostPosted: Fri Nov 01, 2013 9:03 pm 
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Raynil dralas wrote:
Leckan wrote:
Bretons would probably be regarded as second class citizens or worse. I don't even think the Thalmor think too highly of Bosmer, Dunmer, or especially Orsimer either.


Fixed that for you, not every Altmer is a racist fanatic.


Perhaps you are correct. However, aren't eugenics a common practice amongst Altmer to keep their race pure?


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 Post subject: Re: Would Bretons mind if the Thalmor control man?
PostPosted: Fri Nov 01, 2013 9:19 pm 
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Hey guys, moved this to the lore section because it fits better. Carry on.

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 Post subject: Re: Would Bretons mind if the Thalmor control man?
PostPosted: Fri Nov 01, 2013 10:22 pm 
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Yea if our ally in skyrim can be trusted and the thalmor do indeed carry out ethnic purges against the bosmer, than I'm sure the Thalmor would see the bretons as just another sub-species.

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 Post subject: Re: Would Bretons mind if the Thalmor control man?
PostPosted: Sat Nov 02, 2013 12:49 pm 
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Leckan wrote:
Raynil dralas wrote:
Leckan wrote:
Bretons would probably be regarded as second class citizens or worse. I don't even think the Thalmor think too highly of Bosmer, Dunmer, or especially Orsimer either.


Fixed that for you, not every Altmer is a racist fanatic.


Perhaps you are correct. However, aren't eugenics a common practice amongst Altmer to keep their race pure?



The one official source of that is First PGE, and a Thalmor agent angrily complains about the bias against Altmer in the margins of that pamphlet. I believe the eugenics are a thing, but greatly exaggerated.

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 Post subject: Re: Would Bretons mind if the Thalmor control man?
PostPosted: Sat Nov 02, 2013 3:16 pm 
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Leckan wrote:
Raynil dralas wrote:
Leckan wrote:
Bretons would probably be regarded as second class citizens or worse. I don't even think the Thalmor think too highly of Bosmer, Dunmer, or especially Orsimer either.


Fixed that for you, not every Altmer is a racist fanatic.


Perhaps you are correct. However, aren't eugenics a common practice amongst Altmer to keep their race pure?


There's only one source for it: http://www.uesp.net/wiki/Lore:Pocket_Gu ... i_Dominion

And you need only read the first paragraph or so to realise its just anti-elven vitriol.


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 Post subject: Re: Would Bretons mind if the Thalmor control man?
PostPosted: Sat Nov 02, 2013 3:21 pm 
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Yeah. You have to remember the historical context for the First Pocket Guide. It was written during the Tiber Wars. Septim hadn't unified Tamriel yet. Hence "The Wild Regions" and the exotic, often derogatory descriptions of the nonhuman holdings. Michael Kirkbride and Kurt Kuhlmann intended it to be biased on two levels - the pamphlet itself and the scribblings of the Thalmor agent. His views balance out the pamphlet, but he carries his own bias and agenda. However, since these are his personal notes and not for public consumption we might assume they're slightly more honest than Septim's propaganda.

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 Post subject: Re: Would Bretons mind if the Thalmor control man?
PostPosted: Sat Nov 02, 2013 3:36 pm 
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There's a book in-game where the elven author calls the Breton 'cursed' because they have the lifespan of a human, not an elf. In that regard, the mer would consider the Breton flawed elves at best, men at worst.

The Thalmor will truck no mercy upon them.

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 Post subject: Re: Would Bretons mind if the Thalmor control man?
PostPosted: Sat Nov 02, 2013 3:41 pm 
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Also that. The Third Edition PGE is a far less biased and insulting piece.

http://www.uesp.net/wiki/Lore:Pocket_Gu ... /Summerset


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 Post subject: Re: Would Bretons mind if the Thalmor control man?
PostPosted: Sat Nov 02, 2013 5:56 pm 
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Less insulting, yes, but I doubt it's less biased. It's still propaganda, after all, and it's just as littered with uncorroborated information as the First Edition. Who's to say that the Third conveyed an understanding of life in Summerset any closer to the truth than the First? It seems to me they simply took on a different tone and emphasized (or fabricated) different facts to achieve different purposes.

They sought to alienate in the First Edition and thereby create hostility, because that was in the interests of the Empire. In the Third Edition, they sought to soothe and appease in order to foster conciliation, because that was in the interests of the Empire. The bias remains, it just manifests differently with changed circumstances.

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 Post subject: Re: Would Bretons mind if the Thalmor control man?
PostPosted: Tue Nov 05, 2013 2:44 am 
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I really think this question is a little misleading, or at least that it somewhat misses the mark. I don't feel it's true to say that the Thalmor aim to "control man," even under the wildest MK-inspired reading of their motives. On the most sympathetic level of interpretation, the Thalmor are simply an ardent secessionist group who want freedom from the 'oppression' of the Empire of Man, and potentially to reforge the Aldmeri Dominion of old, and on the most hardcore of the hardcore levels they aim to undo creation and ascend (re-scend?) to their 'rightful' position. Men are really not the most prominent thing on the Thalmor's mind, in either interpretation. If anything, their an annoyance or an obstacle, but surely not a primary objective.

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 Post subject: Re: Would Bretons mind if the Thalmor control man?
PostPosted: Tue Nov 05, 2013 9:32 am 
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Minor Edits wrote:
Less insulting, yes, but I doubt it's less biased. It's still propaganda, after all, and it's just as littered with uncorroborated information as the First Edition. Who's to say that the Third conveyed an understanding of life in Summerset any closer to the truth than the First? It seems to me they simply took on a different tone and emphasized (or fabricated) different facts to achieve different purposes.

They sought to alienate in the First Edition and thereby create hostility, because that was in the interests of the Empire. In the Third Edition, they sought to soothe and appease in order to foster conciliation, because that was in the interests of the Empire. The bias remains, it just manifests differently with changed circumstances.


Less biased against the Altmer is what I meant.


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