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Ok well playing dark games like Fallout3 is becoming a pain on my nana's Tv as the brightness only goes up to 63 for some reason, like it's capped there and even moving around the other sliders like the colour still doesn't change anything, anyone have any ideas? (I'll post the tv details on saturday-after I get to see the tv again)

Ugh thats annoying isnt it? Try the tint i guess.

I usually compensate for differences in brightness between games solely by adjusting the Brightness/Contrast or Gamma settings in the game's Options. It means I NEVER have to touch my 32" LCD TV's Brightness/Contrast controls.

My TV is the centre of my entertainment system. I watch Satellite TV via SCART input, watch DVD's via HDMI input and also use it as my PC monitor for gaming, etc, via PC input (for standard 15-pin D-type monitor cable). If I was having to adjust the TV's Brightness/Contrast every time I switched between SCART/HDMI and PC, I'd be tearing my hair out!

Ok well let me explain, the game's brightness is maxed and the Tv's brightness won't go higher than 63 which pretty much makes the game brightness much weaker than 100%

well, at least for oblivion/fallout 3, if the brightness is doubled from 50/100(normal) to 100/100(max), then cut in ~1/2 by the tv(63/100), the brightness would be at roughly 63/100, just brighter than normal for the two games.
or is 100/100 neutral on your tv?

OK, we need to narrow this down, Dragour... Which version of Fallout 3 are you talking about? For Xbox 360? PS3? PC? And what type of TV does Nana have? The old CRT (Cathode Ray Tube) type? LCD? Plasma? If you can answer these questions, I may be able to help you. In the meantime...

I've done some Google searches and found a few forums where people are complaining that 360 versions of Fallout 3 and Oblivion are significantly darker than the PS3 or PC versions. With in-game Brightness at maximum, night-time in the game's day/night cycle is still way too dark. Bethesda/UBIsoft really need to balance their game brightness levels between platforms, methinks!

Suggestions that might help...

360: Try reading the 360's manual (or search on-line) to find out how to adjust its TV output settings. Here's an Xbox 360 specific thread I found at AVSForums. It may help you, as some of the posts have info on 360 settings such as Black Level, HDMI Color Space, etc.

PS3: I don't know. Again, reading the manual or searching on-line might help.

PC: Have you tried adjusting Brightness/Contrast/Gamma in your Video Driver control panel? If this works, and the Driver allows you to create "application-specific profiles", try creating a profile for Fallout 3 to automatically apply settings when the game starts up. My nVidia driver has this capability, so I assume ATI drivers will have it too.

CRT TV's: Many years ago, I trained as a TV Engineer and cut my teeth on these. The older the TV, the more likely it is to have "age syndrome", i.e. typical age-related problems that result in a dimmer than normal picture. The older 4:3 screen ratio CRT TV's are particularly prone to this, since they're often well over 10 years old. Newer 16:9 widescreen CRT TV's can start developing problems in less than 10 years, due to their larger 16:9 tubes having higher power requirements than 4:3 tubes. The only solution is to call out a TV Engineer, and replacement parts plus labour can be more expensive than buying a cheap LCD or Plasma TV of the same screen size! This is why CRT TV's are rapidly going extinct.

Oh well. My training might be outdated, but my "bloodhound's nose" for fault finding is still handy!

Hope this helps.

Ok well both Fallout3 and Oblivion are xbox360, but the games work perfectly with the brightness around midway on all other Tv's, it is only my Nana's two tv's that they refuse to work for me.. worst part is, both the tvs are actually quite new so it can't be that they're too old?

OK. If you're having no problem on other TV's with game/360 settings unchanged, then the problem isolates to Nana's TV.

TV's needn't necessarily be old to have problems. It depends on the manufacturer, their TV design, quality of their new parts, etc. The biggest manufacturers (Sony, Samsung, Philips, Sanyo, Hitachi, etc) GET to be that big because their goods ARE reliable and millions of people buy because they KNOW that. Small manufacturers you've never heard of before tend to remain small because their goods aren't so reliable, even unreliable, so people avoid buying from them.

Unfortunately, you haven't answered my question as to what type of TV we're talking about. Without that info, I can't exclude ALL problems related to other TV types to narrow down the possible causes. Is it CRT, LCD or Plasma? In fact, to save time, read off the make (on the front, e.g. Sanyo) and the model number (on the rear label) and post back with them. I can then research the TV specs and common known problems with that make/model. In the meantime, I'm still guessing here...

Backlight age: Pixels on LCD/Plasma screens can only produce dim light on their own. Normal picture brightness is achieved by an overall screen backlight (usually a flourescent or cold cathode bulb). This typically dims with age and eventually fails completely, requiring replacement. Average backlight bulb lifetime is around 20,000 hours but for cheap TV's it may be less. Nana's TV backlight may be dim due to the age of the TV, and may even be close to failure. Try asking her if the TV seemed much brighter when it was brand new.

Backlight brightness: Newer LCD/Plasma TV's usually have a backlight brightness control to allow the user to set a preferred level of brightness. It's not always in the user Setup menus, more often being found in the hidden Service Menu (factory setup and Engineers only). If you know the exact TV make/model, you can usually find the Service Menu access method on the web. It might be possible to increase backlight brightness this way. WARNING: In the Service Menu, make note of EVERY original setting and NEVER change a setting unless you KNOW what it does beforehand! Messing with factory settings can easily render a TV unusable and even damage it, requiring an expensive Engineer call-out to return the TV to normal or repair it. This is exactly WHY the Service Menu is "hidden" in the first place, so unqualified "chronic fiddlers" can't "chronically fiddle"!!!

Dirty screen: Is anyone in the house a smoker? If so, years of tar/nicotine build-up is a PRIME culprit for screen dimming (the classic "brown filter" effect)! In non-smoker's homes, dirt build-up can cause some dimming effect. Even in the cleanest homes, you often find the TV screen hasn't been cleaned since new (people think the TV will go wrong if they touch it)! Try cleaning the screen with a slightly damp cloth. If the cloth comes away yellowish/orangey brown, that's tar/nicotine for you (turns your lungs the same colour as well)!

Easiest Solution: If possible, why not simply take a TV to Nana's WITH you? E.g. A portable TV. That way, you won't be using her TV, so no brightness problem!

Because we don't have a portable tv, they're to expensive and I have to go to my nana's twice a week and drop everything (my xbox360) off in the morning before being late to work XD

Sorry I don't have the details as I'm not at my nana's place and lets just say that she isn't one to ask about information of things... if the tv was a sony then she'd probably argue that it was a panasonic... for some god knows reason

Ah well. Maybe next time you're there you can get the make/model directly? Then I'll be able to narrow it down and help you out if at all possible.

Ok I finally have all the details of one of the tv's (the lounge one-main)

Panasonic, 21 system/triple stereo
Model #- TX-33GF85X
110V-240V ~ 50/60Hz 20SW

I don't understand over half of that, but if any of it helps solve the problem then I'm happy... oh and


"Made in Japan"... I think I found the problem!

Thanks for the model number, Dragour! That's exactly what I needed.

Searching for the TV by model number shows that, as I strongly suspected, it's an old CRT TV. I can find NO info on Panasonic's global website and I only get a paltry 16 search results via Google which are either second hand ads or forum posts asking for the service manual. Classic signs of a discontinued model that's no longer supported by the manufacturer.

I found an on-line auction site with an ad dating from 2006 selling a 4 year old TV, and 2006-4 = 2002. If the seller originally bought that TV NEW in 2002, we can estimate that Nana's TV may be at least 7 years old.

CRT TV's are notorious for their picture gradually dimming over time due to continuous electrical stress from the VERY high voltages required to drive the tube. A 33" tube, for example, typically requires a 4th Anode voltage of at least 30,000 Volts! Smaller tubes require less, i.e. a 26" tube typically requires 25,000 Volts. The larger the tube size, the higher the stress and the faster the picture dims with age. That's why CRT screens never got much larger than 30". In contrast, LCD/Plasma screens require very little power, so they've already grown to over 100"!

If you have game, console and TV brightness at maximum, the dim picture is most likely due to CRT age-related dimming (especially with a large 33" screen). The only way to resolve this (often only partially) is to call out a TV Engineer and, even then, parts for discontinued models are usually difficult to find (and therefore expensive), not to mention labour cost per hour. It's often cheaper to buy a new LCD or Plasma TV instead!

Sorry, but I'm afraid this is about as far as I can help you.

Ok just to clarify this, the brightness on the Tv can only go up to 63, it's not dark when it's set on 100... as there is no 100, but thanks for trying, guess my nana is going to have to buy a new Tv which she can do afford despite saying how poor she is (she is frekn rich!)

The range of values on the Brightness control doesn't matter because the TV screen emits its maximum intensity of light when that control is at it's maximum setting. A larger range of Brightness values simply gives a smaller intensity increase per step, is all.

Let's say a TV screen puts out the same maximum light intensity as a 20 Watt light bulb. A Brightness control range of 0 to 63 gives 20/63 = 0.317 Watts per step whereas a range of 0 to 100 gives 20/100 = 0.2 Watts per step. At maximum 63, we have 63*0.317 = 20. At maximum 100, we have 100*0.2 = 20. In either case, maximum Brightness setting gives maximum intensity of 20 Watts.

Now let's age the TV until it's maximum screen intensity is halved from 20 to 10 Watts. In either case, the Brightness control range is still the same so the intensity increase per step is halved (10/63 = 0.159 or 10/100 = 0.1). Maximum Brightness setting now gives maximum intensity of 10 Watts (63*0.159 = 10 or 100*0.1 = 10).